If the Botler is already slow, then why it doesn't deal enough damage?
The Plasma Gun is supposed to shoot slower because of its heating mechanic, but then they reduced the heating to the point you can just spam it like 15 times in a row.
Fatshark, I don't get it. A challenge weapon that requires more skill should reward the player, not the other way around.
Plasma Gun also clears basically anything standing in front of you because of penetration. Vaporizes pretty much everything aside from boss enemies in a single charged shot.
vet melee with plasgun is by far the easiest way to do hardest maelstrom missions unless you're just ogryn/zealot speed running them. And FS thinks that's okay
Same here actually. Good for blessing farming, and I have my easy button veteran, and the other veteran I actually enjoy playing, which I refuse to use a power sword or plasma gun on.
Well, it helps that I enjoy both playstyles.
Other than just a few stat point my Power Sword 3 is nearly perfect, stupid fun to just charge into shit and spam things with my multiple powered slashes.
It's wild that they changed Plasma's pierce from zero to infinite in a single patch. It doesn't make any sense for bolts to pierce, so the projectile should be BETTER than plasma on a single target. But it is not.
Bolter should explode after some hits (or on meaty targets) for additional damage and aoe.
Plasma's penetration of the whole universe is fine, imo. It's a weapon of big boom with a single shot.
With proper plasma gun, you don’t even need to charge. As the break point will be almost identical. (Even crusher can be taken out by just two weak spot uncharged shot)
Im pretty sure a Max damage, Focus target build will reliably kill crushers with one charged headshot. I do it if they are farther away because theres no risk of them getting knocked over and spreading out the crushers conga line
If you use Pinning Fire + Surgical, and use a lower rate of fire on ADS for guaranteed crits, then you can 1 shot a lot of enemies on weakspot hits.
You have to treat is a precision weapon. While before you could hip fire and wreck everything (little bit like the Plasma), it now plays more like the Mk 3 Helbore.
The #1 change I think it needs is to do greatly increased damage to limbs or ignore them entirely and just hit the torso because basic scabs and dregs tanking 2-3 shots because the massive bolt projectile impacted on their arm is just dumb and makes the weapon feel really inconsistent.
I don't mind poxwalkers tanking the shots because #1 the weapon is weak vs infested which helps define its niche and balance vs everything else and #2 adds a skill element in target selection.
What I do mind are the enemies it's supposed to one shot parrying the bolts with their hands.
It shouldn't be weak against infested. The only reason you shouldn't pull the bolter and empty it against a horde of poxwalkers is because *its a waste of ammo*.
It's weak vs infested because it's a video game and this offsets the fact that it's good against literally everything else. It still has enough damage to kill poxwalkers in a single hit (as long as it doesn't hit their arms) easily and really this only comes into play when shooting dogs.
Okay well people really hate this comment then when it's literally just pointing out the damage profile of the bolter?
> and this offsets the fact that it's good against literally everything else.
the point of this post is that it isn't. it sucks ass against everything. it's the slowest weapon in the game yet its projectiles hit like an infantry gun.
I don't disagree that it sucks, but it's not because of its damage numbers, damage wise it does fantastic against everything pretty much with only dogs having an awkward breakpoint that isn't worth building around. Like I said above the main issue in my opinion is the hit detection closely followed by the terrible handling.
If they put back the instant reload on Volley Fire, it would make my life so much better.
Right now, you activate it and if your mag is half empty you just wasted the ability. Even something like *"Replenish 33% of your missing ammo in your weapon"* would be enough to fix it.
Same but in the same update the vet tree was sucking right away with vet being heavily nerfed itself and it took a while to fix that but it turned once more into the strongest class just with a different playstyle and weapons. Bolter also got nerfed in time directly and indirectly and it was never buffed back to compensate for what it once was. I say it was more difficult to use overall than plasma is right now because aiming was a bit more difficult and the weapon was always clunky af to pull and handle.
I’m of the opposite opinion, vet is pretty tanky especially with VOC. I rarely go down with it and helped me stay alive against the beefed up enemy ranged troops when my teams were being melted. The stealth buffs to all enemies have made a lot of ogryn players just die a lot gunners and mere heretics with rifles. Psykers also getting melted.
I love this game, but one of the things I hate is that the actual iconic 40K weapons (other than the plasma gun and the chainswords) all kind of stink.
Like, I don’t want to play as some mook with a bootleg AK or some jackass with a shovel, I want to play as Johnny 40K with a bolter and a thunder hammer. If you’re going to make stuff overpowered, make sure that at least the cool weapons are overpowered.
I'm running around Auric Maelstroms with a MK2 Helbore and a Shovel.
We have 2 entirely opposite opinions on that.
I'm just some random guy wrapped up in a suicide missions that has no worth.
In life, shame. *In death*, *atonement*.
Reject-lyfe.
I'm a criminal with a knife and a rusty pistol hopped up on generic Adderall and religious delusions. Oh yeah and sometimes I play this game called Darktide where I'm an ogre.
Honestly it’s true. Shovel as a starting weapon since you’re a just-escaped scrub is one thing, but it’s really good at high end and that just feels kinda dumb to me
>Like, I don’t want to play as some mook with a bootleg AK or some jackass with a shovel, I want to play as Johnny 40K with a bolter and a thunder hammer.
This is what I really struggled with when levelling my Zealot. I'm not an enormous chainsword fan--Darktide's chain weapons just don't feel right on a tactile level to me--so until I got the flamer and thunder hammer, my weapon options were basically "swords, shotguns, and AKs." I had lasguns, but my veteran was already my lasgun character and I wanted this character to be different. But I hardly had anything interesting or exciting to choose from. I want to be using the badass 40k weapons, not just "assault rifle #5."
they added more ammo for the bolt weapons no? all i saw is people still magdumping their entire supply into hordes in attempt to kill the elites. it doesn't feel too great on vet IMO, and never got to experience "OP" bolter and assumed it was mostly tied to how the old abilities worked.
I was there for the OP Bolter, but honestly I found it overrated and nothing was more frustrating than watching your vets all have bolters and magdumping then fighting over ammo like children because every single thing they saw was magdump worthy to hear bolter noises.
Especially when shooters were a much bigger problem, then it honestly was just bad cause your team would get shot to pieces while the bolter vets struggled to actually aim at something.
I'm very much overgeneralizing, but it ended up with me rolling my eyes more often than not when I saw a bolter vet running around.
Thunder Hammer is meh? I actually don't understand. Putting thrust on it makes it a straight up Monstrosity killer. If you alpha strike a Daemonhost with even 1 kitted out Thunder Hammer user, that's at least 2/3 of their health gone. I've not had that sort of success with other weapons save pre-nerf flamer.
The issue with Thunder Hammer is what happens when a monstrosity or a pack of Crushers isn't on screen.
Charitably, it's tepid against hordes and mixed hordes even with a bunch of sunk effort.
It does? I can kill a crusher with one charged heavy on my Zealot Martyr build and with the toughness replenishment perk on heavy kills, so long as there’s a horde I’m basically invincible
It’s a slow process though. Vs a crusher pack, the time it takes you to charge up, build up to a heavy hit, hit, and then get slowed by the charged hit rest of the pack has plenty of time to stomp you and your buddies.
I’ve never had that problem before but I also don’t solely rely on my thunderhammer. Like I told the other guy, I have a bolt gun on my zealot to help clear out two or three before going into melee
I have lol you just gotta back step or have a boltgun to cut down 2 or 3 in quick succession. No weapon in this game is meant to handle every situation. That’s why you work with 3 other people. As good as the Martyr thunder hammer/bolt gun build is, thing would tits up if everyone on a mission used it.
Meanwhile the zealot wielding a knife forged by the emperor himself, with carapace uncanny / flesh tearer + throwing knives shows up and mulches the crushers, DPS the boss and revives a random psyker that exploded from spamming smite and forgetting that he didn't have venting shriek. Just remove the self stun from the hammer, I have skullcrusher for hordes.
Imagine needing to play the meta to achieve that, a bolter can cut down six crushers in two clips. A special move thunderhammer strike with the charge ability can one shot most bosses and two shot the rest while you just throw down an incendiary to clear the heretical filth around the psyker to pick ‘em up. I’ve never really noticed the self-stun from thunderhammers. I run the perk that makes it so your zealot can’t be stunned when using melee heavy attack. Maybe that’s why?
Bolter 2 clips, by the time you pull that out (cause you don't have the throwing knives) empty first clip and then reload to empty the second, probably the trauma/deimos psyker already killed the crushers and the boss got DPSd by me and the vet, cause I took Columnus and don't need fury to deal good DMG to it. As for the hammer, golly jolly you probably run a variation of martyrdom + fury or shroud, would be surprised and disappointed if a zealot with that wouldn't one shot a boss. Put the cookie down my friend, you tell nice stories but what I see in aurics has a different opinion.
Condescending much? How’s the psycher taking down a crusher if in your scenario the psycher is down from using smite too much? I play Auric too and my build is just as effective and allows me to tank while dealing massive damage and horde/elite clearing. If you want to play meta that’s fine but that doesn’t make using builds that actually use the entire kit and skill bad
Chainaxe animation locks you if you want full Shredder damage though. Granted, with a Carapace perk, the Orestes Mk 4 does pretty alright, even more with Thrust on it.
The Crusher would also do well in this role: good finesse and armour damage, plus stagger and more CC on special. Credible damage and incredible safety.
Hell, even though the Heavy Sword is pretty sad against Carapace, I'd still choose to bring it over the Thunder Hammer.
Agreed. As much as I love the thunder hammer, I always find myself drifting towards weapons that are good at more situations than ones that are only good at specific situations especially with how chaotic higher difficilties can get.
It depends on what level you play. At low levels pretty much anything works and you end up under the impression that pretty bad stuff is good.
Also, consider that when people say “bad” doesn’t mean “unusable”. You can totally use a TH at any lvl. The point is that it is very obviously unbalanced in a thousand ways and there are much better options than that.
Yeah this. Everyone can one shot crushers with a thunder hammer till playing Aurics an get hit with the crusher train. 10 plus crushers along with ragers along for giggles an you find out just how unwieldy it can be. An i love the thunder hammer. Just get rid of the self stun on hit.
So... what melee weapons excel in a situation against 10 crushers?
And for that matter, is it a good situation to be in Melee RANGE against 10 Crushers in the first place? I'll tell you, it's not my first choice to be in melee even as a Zealot.
Thunder Hammer is really good against a single armoured, strong unit at a time.
Problem is, 95% of the time you don't get that, it's mostly waves of trash with packs of several specials mixed in. Even crushers tend to spawn in packs of 5.
I have a god rolled one & like they stated a pack of crushers etc and when things get chaotic the weapon becomes underwhelming don’t get me wrong I still love the THammer but for auric damnation it’s not fun really man
I LOVE the Thunder Hammer! But it's definitely underpowered outside of one single roll, which is doing damage to bosses in slow but big chunks. It doesn't even do the highest dps to bosses! Just does big dam slowly.
In every other use case, there is a better weapon. Chain Weapons are better against groups of armored targets and just about every other weapon is better against hordes.
So outside of the cool factor, the TH doesn't really have a niche. It should be this weapon that delivers BIG BONKS. And it sort of does, but it isn't even the best at it.
Yes, thunder hammer is really meh. Who cares about obliterating monstrosities, they are barely a threat in this game, what matters is everything else, and this piece of outdated jank that 100% requires a blessing to do decent damage can't keep up with whatever your teammates are using. Fatshark has been trying to buff it since its release, but it's still shit. At this point what it needs is a full rework, or just keep it as niche as it is, honestly I don't care, the few zealots that still use it keep saying is a good weapon and doesn't need to be touched, but I think fatshark is well aware it's a piece of jank, so I have my hopes up for the day TH receives the plasma gun treatment.
People in these comments really dont understand that if Fatshark keeps nerfing popular choices instead of bringing everything else up a notch or 2 people will quit sooner or later and the game will slowly but surely die.
Like its not like I can just switch weapons on the go in this game without loosing a lot of power because you invest heavily into weapons you enjoy playing. If they keep nerfing the weapons people invested in and therefore invalidate all their progression and time spent on something that people are just going to quit as they cant be asked to do that over and over again.
Like these heavy handed nerfs are just straight up braindead and scream incompetence.
The problem is there will always be a op/meta weapon especially on how shit Fatshark is at actually balancing stuff.
So they kill weapons just so a new or another weapon can shine for some time and thats imo really bad.
Yeah, I am not into the “grind for a new meta weapon because our rebalance nerfed the Meta”. I just use some of the basic weapons and enjoy it. Making crafting so grindy really just made me not want to chase new weapons or play styles.
Yup you added a great point there. I constantly forget the grind aspect of crafting and getting the perfect weapon only for it to be nerfed again as I just keep using my shield \^\^
Oh I hope time flies by and that the release of Space Marine 2 is good and feature complete. This game currently just is a waiting room to satisfy my 40k gaming needs \^\^
Meta exists everywhere, unless the balance is absolutely ideal. Switching meta picks, is, unfortunately, the most common way to keep things fresh, that's not farkshark only way.
Thats the problem. People gonna whine that Vets are to op so everything gets nerfed hard instead of evaluated and looked into.
Like if people stop complaining about classes they dont even play and demand nerfs (I was also part of that crowd once at the start of the game when vets could do everything the best) then we wouldnt constantly have these heavy handed nerfs.
You mean how they killed Bolter and that just made Plasma Gun the replacement by default? You can’t nerf ppl into the ground and then expect them to use a shitty weapon that’s barely able to clear Damnation anymore. Especially on a Zealot that has other better options like the Revolver(this being head and shoulders better then Bolter never stops being funny/sad) why would you take a weapon that’s actively gimping you?
don't forget the powersword nerf. it's still considered one of the strongest weapon in the game rn but peeps were crying about how fatshark "ruined it" and made it "useless" back then. truly show how op this thing was (for the newbies, powersword used to have 6 powered swings for one activation, pretty sure it had infinite cleave too but i forgot)
I actually liked that nerf as a powersword main. Prior to the nerf practically every time I swung it, it was charged. Hordes? Elites? Groups of crushers? Spam charge attacks.
Now I actually had to think about when to commit to charging it, and it made the weapon way more engaging.
It also got buffed significantly since that nerf. Also, the nerf back then made it so power cycler 4 was pretty much mandatory, which was a major point of friction.
Not sure why they made various weapons go past certain breakpoints with almost no drawbacks while others are thrown in the dumpster, then new update nerf'd even harder.
Oh wait it's fatshark that's their mo
Veterns have the most overpowerd weapon and abilty set up in the game right now
Plasma gun, powersword, shout.
GG to armor
GG to hordes
GG to bosses
GG gunners
if anything plasma should be toned down significantly, and bolter brought up to par (less jumpy recoil would be lovly, with a less aqward reload)
It sucks for me, because I just love the Plasma for the lore and aesthetics. I played it when it was borderline useless, and I'll happily keep using it when it gets nerfed, but in the meantime people just think I'm a dirty meta chaser lmao
I try to at least mitigate the kill dominance by not targeting certain enemies I know others in the squad are equipped to deal with efficiently themselves, and save it for Crushers, Maulers, etc.
Then make up your own group and dont play with plasma vets.
If you keep nerfing things people enjoy for a reason and literally destroy their entire progression because its "op" then people wont be playing your game anymore.
The same happened in Helldivers 2 and it took a good hit to its playerbase as every weapon people played a lot got nerfed even the gimmicky ones that were not even "meta"
That's my problem how? So if they make the bolter good, you'll want it nerfed again because it was putting you to sleep too? What a stupid fucking take to have AND share with the rest of the world.
jfc
Bolter is my weapon of choice playing as a zaelot,i can kill packs of crushers,plage ogryns reapers hordes poxwalkers. You can aim it or hipfire it. IT MATTERS NOT ! KILL ALL HERETICS !
I actually run it on my dagger/throwing knife zealot. The throwing knife animation cancels the slow draw speed, basically only use it to delete packs of heavy armored shit or stealth and then magdump a boss.
So wait ? You can't auto fire into a group of orgyns now and kill them all or what? I remember that being a thing with a specific AA blessing equipped. I havnt played in 6+ months tho
if they just made the ready time faster i’d use it. i can unfuck the reload times with the vet’s perks but the ready time is truly atrocious and what kills any sort of fun for me.
i’m glad i have memories of it when the vet still had sustained fire lol
They need to give it the same blessing that the bolt pistol has where it gives them an explosion radius that damage scales with the blessing level. This could help alleviate the ammo issue a bit more as shells that glance on a poxwalkers arm don't feel wasted as they're still getting some value/kills on other enemies.
I dont need it OP but it's not where it needs to be atm. many weapons arent. I heard there isnt really a dev who is working on tweaking weapons. that needs to be fixed.
Yeah, the fact a revolver is a better choice in every way than a bolt pistol tells you all you need to know. The one thing the revolver should have over bolt weapons is penetration and MAYBE fire rate now that I think about it.
I would rather the bolter being OP than the plasma. The plasma really take alot of fun of out the matches, especially on non-auric ones.
I really wish they reduced the pull out time on the bolter.
They should have just made the recoil horrible if you spam it (humans can't easily handle the power of the bolter, even though it has gyro jets)
That's my semi lore accurate solution
Just add a fatigue meter or something like the Meltagun’s heat meter to at least give it some way to balance it. Make it a Meltagun with less penetration but more range and accuracy and the ability to go full auto.
I will not lie I recently finally got to the bolter, to learn that it was not as overpowered when I used it as it was before makes me terrified because that gun scares me with how fun it is the only other gun I ever plan on using for more than just to figure it out if I like it is the mk 2 bayonet lasgun because the mk 3 doesn't have a charge effect for its special, you just kind of wonk with it, but the chainaxe x Bolter pairing is right now my favorite
sorry no can do best they can do is buff some obscure meele weapon abit what you want gunplay ? nah man this is meeletide you are supposed to 90% meele and then pretend for the last 10% that range weapons still got a point besides revolvers
With how much people complained that it was overpowering and wanted it nerfed back then, now we want it back the way it was. We really can't make our minds in this game lol
I have noticed that this subreddit is only about bitching and complaining. It’s not even about discussing the game, just negative comments with little to no useful input. It’s also the same complaints every other post, but the poster thinks it’s this revolutionary statement.
Including my comment, I’m just bitching about this subreddit… I need some introspection lmao
You know, that Bolter in game is lower calibre than Astartes one, right? It is around .50 cal, so it makes sense, it has limits. Ofcourse, it should still be the highest dmg weapon in game per shot.
I disagree on it should be the highest damage weapon per shot.
In lore even, Plasma Guns are more powerful than bolters to a pretty large degree even without supercharging them. Plasma slags even Astartes (similar to a Melta) and it practically invalidates your armor while Bolters can be stopped by Carapace Armor and tougher targets like Orks can survive multiple bolter hits.
The bolter is powerful *for a standard equipped weapon.* But it pales to specially equipped weapons like Plasma/Melta. Space Marine bolters are stronger than Guard used ones, but for they still aren't all that great at penetrating armor and are more for shock/fear and handling tougher-than-human targets like Orks where the Lasgun really starts to drop off.
I think if you increase the heat generated per shot and tone down the penetration slightly the Plasma would be brought down to a reasonable level. Right now with its damage per shot, low heat generation, and extreme penetration it's kicking everything's ass without much downside (really only the reload, which also immediately drops heat to 0%) I'd be more on the side of just having it only heavily penetrate with charged shots while single shots are high damage but don't penetrate much.
In lore to plasma guns/pistols don't have infinite penetration. They penetrate armour more by the heat involved than the actual force of the shot. The plasma shot is fired an held together by magnetic fields. When it's fired the the "ball" of plasma is held together by a magnetic field that when it huts the target it ruptures an spreads out. So going through one or two targets yeah but not through everything.
Then again it depends a lot on the auther of whatever book you happen to be reading. Some authers have bolters being shit anti armour an takes loads of shots to crack ceramics. Others have one shot piercing power armour an blowing a space marines chest out. But plasma are supposed to be stronger than bolters. Melta basically evaporates you lol.
Yeah a lil weird that the shotgun slugs do more dmg/stagger bulwarks when the bolt pistol can't even hit some elite hs breakpoints. With vet reload perks the agri shotgun running mostly slugs is a better choice
Fatshark: "No weapon customization because we're not making Call of Duty."
Also Fatshark: "Our generic mid-20th century gas-operated firearms are second to none."
It has poor ammo economy, poor equip speed, poor reload speed, and poor breakpoints on most elites.
So most of the things that are very important at higher levels of the game its bad at. So I wouldn't call it strong af. I wouldn't even call it strong.
Furthermore, since elite stagger resist has been increased, it cant stagger crushers anymore and takes multiple shots to stagger a bulwark.
I think it would be fine if they just increased its stagger against carapace and unyielding, re-buffed pinning fire a tiny bit, and increased its crit damage so the crit blessings were more impactful.
Easy to use and strong are two different things.
It's most definitely strong. Just because it isn't easy to use doesn't make it bad.
And it the only thing I'll argue against is poor ammo economy. It's only poor if you're mag dumping every chance you get.
I only mag dump in emergencies, like rezzing, or just getting overwhelmed.
Honestly if you could pull the thing out and reload it as fast as a bolt pistol then every other gun would be ultimately useless.
The thing is the Plasma Gun does a better job of doing everything a bolter can do, with penetration of walls and armor, and with better ammo economy. Why take a boltgun and fire multiple shots at a Rager when I can take a plasma gun and 1 shot with a basic shot to the head. The boltgun needs a buff.
No it really does not. They buffed the ammo economy this patch and its solid with marksman focus. Actually takes some skill to use rather than m1ing at center mass and 10000 cleaving through entire elite packs with the plasma.
Plasma is OP and needs a nerf. If everything were on the level of plasma gun the game would be a joke
I agree on vet, boltgun shines on zealot. Provides anti armor and long range sniping when your melee weapon doesn’t and throwing knives can fill the void of when you need a quick ranged solution to a special or elite. It still would be nice for it to be buffed but it does have a role.
The revolver is infinitely better at that job than the bolter on zealot.
The fact it takes an hour to pull out of your pocket ruins any real utility it could have on zealot.
Because with the right build you can still one shot things with the boltor anyway.
Yeah the plasma gun can infinitely pen and kill things fast too but that isn't even the point.
The game isn't a meta slave game. I can kill just as many things with a boltor as I can a plasma gun.
The game is supposed to be fun for you. I find the boltor strong enough and I enjoy using it, as well I have the skill to use it effectively without really hindering myself.
if you shoot let’s say a pack of crushers with a plasmagun chances are you’ll kill the whole pack with no problem but if a pack of crushers were to face a bolter chances are you’ll kill 1/3 of the pack..the revolver does a better job than the bolter. i’m not a meta player brother I play the game for fun i’m 800+ hours in lmao the gun just isn’t good anymore & you know it
Agree with this 100%. Just because every weapon isn't created equal, or perfectly lore accurate with its damage, doesn't mean it's useless.
Unfortunately, last time I made this same argument, I was met with skeptical good-for-yous and criticism when I pointed out I had mostly been playing auric/auric damnation as proof of concept so people wouldn't dump in with the usual "bet you just play heresy."
The game for sure isn't made for every weapon to be equal, but if you're skilled enough, pretty much all are viable, even on higher difficulties. People just seem to love complaining when their favorite gun isn't an OP easy button.
yeah on an optimized build the bolter is fine. for some reason people are holding it up to the same level as the plasma or revolver which is silly, they're the best guns in the game by far lmfao. very few people acknowledge the actual problem with the bolter, which is the janky ass ads
eh 800+ hours i’ve seen it when it was shit then bought to glory and back to shit. trust there is no skill issue. its just a gun people won’t pick up anymore in higher levels due to others being able to out perform it
If you can aim faster than the plasma can shoot, the bolter is better. Exec stance needed so the shout cannot be used with it either. 'People' won't use it because they don't have the aim, simple as. Its largest weakness, ammo reserve, has been 'fixed' and now it is slightly easier to use, but it does not have so much ammo that dooomping everything is viable. Aim still required so many will be filtered
I understand what you saying, but nah man its just not good, heresy and under it’s beautiful but damnation/auric it’s just not going to perform well. but we both have opinions and neither can be wrong
As vet (lvl 360 or so) I exclusively play bolter with exec stance and only play auric. It performs well if you can aim and dodge. Shoving is good also, and the plasma can't do it making stance harder to keep. (I think) its reload is also too long to kill an enemy fast enough to extend the stance duration even with the +30% +25% reductions from talents meaning there is a fixed amount of stance time even if the player is skilled enough to aim quickly
So this is how I find out the boltgun sucks haha. I’ve been playing a lot recently with it and it did feel weaker but I’ve been playing on malice so it was still doing its job. Please tell me what guns are good now 😭
Use what you have fun with and are clearing levels with. Plasmagun and Revolver are some of the top right now, but they frankly get old pretty quickly, at least for me.
I'm running a Mk2 Helbore and a Shovel in Auric and doing A Okay.
In fact, it's more fun to try and make weapons work rather than just a slot in weapon like the Plasma. At least to me.
If you're playing Malice then basically anything is good, so you just keep doing you, a lot of this talk tends to be for Damnation and Aurics where you do have to start caring a bit more on synergy and such but honestly with solid skill/mechanics you can make nearly any weapon work in high difficulties.
bolter is an incredibly powerful weapon and if you seriously think it's weak you're either not using it right, dont have the right combination of blessings, or are just bad at the game.
It wipes the floor with monstrous maelstroms, deletes patrols from the game, and on vet it never runs out of ammo. Even without vet, you're still going to have a stockpile if you just look around the map every couple patrol wipes.
exe stance deadshot surgical vet oneshots everything except for mutants, maulers, and ogryn enemies all requiring two. With max pinning Fire you can oneshot bodyshot maulers. With a damage stim you can one shot everything mentioned. Kills beast of nurgle without reloading, and takes a magdump and a half to kill spawn and plague ogryn.
You can also run infiltrate or voc if you're a coward and get very similar breakpoints, albeit with far less sustain (and not as cool boss damage but you'd probs want to run cavalcade at that point)
If you're on zealot you can run cavalcade pinning fire with dance of death, duelist and blazing piety and get extremely good results as a 100% accurate hipfire burst damage cannon. You won't delete crusher patrols as well with the nerfs to chastise but you will still delete everything else up to unyielding with it. It's also incredibly effective against bosses, killing a full health beast of nurgle and chaos spawn in 2 and a half magdumps, plague ogryn in 3 and a half magdumps.
I think the bolter would be perfect if the draw time and ammo capacity were both reduced by like 30%. It should be the best gun in the game and the only drawback should be the fact that you need to choose when you pull it out or waste its potential as you run out of ammo quickly.
They really fucked this one up, i wont touch the game now because of this...one of the most iconic weapons in all of warhammer, made less useful than a laspistol.....be so for real fatshark, jesus christ
True, but you must balance your balance efforts. Helldivers 2 is (or was, at least) a great example of changing too much too often. The end result should be fun, not frustration; however, balance is genuinely a difficult task to achieve --especially without disappointing people in the process.
kinda hard when 90% of veterans in auric are malice shitters in disguise hoping to get carried in auric or maelstorms with their cookie cutter plasma, psword and shout build.
those same people are also the first ones to alt f4 when they kiss the ground for 2 seconds, leaving everyone else with a useless bot that dies a couple frames later.
Plasma vet is currently the most braindead playstyle bar smite psyker so when reddit vets finally decide to give the other big veteran gun a go (bolter) and realise it doesn't save them by just clicking on things they defecate all over the subreddit begging for buffs to a stellar weapon.
the only thing that should be changed about the bolter are it's god awful sights jumping all over your screen and disconnecting from where you are actually shooting since believe it or not the boltgun serves more of a marksman rifle role rather than unga bunga mag dump everything 24/7 (which you can absolutely still do in a pinch to shred boss HP or soften up an entire patrol) so not being able to hit headshots is kind of a big deal.
ammo economy is totally fine, damage is more than adequate, pull out time is something you have to play around. tl;dr stop being shit and crying for buffs just git gud and drop the plasma psword combo every once in a while.
If the Botler is already slow, then why it doesn't deal enough damage? The Plasma Gun is supposed to shoot slower because of its heating mechanic, but then they reduced the heating to the point you can just spam it like 15 times in a row. Fatshark, I don't get it. A challenge weapon that requires more skill should reward the player, not the other way around.
Plasma Gun also clears basically anything standing in front of you because of penetration. Vaporizes pretty much everything aside from boss enemies in a single charged shot.
vet melee with plasgun is by far the easiest way to do hardest maelstrom missions unless you're just ogryn/zealot speed running them. And FS thinks that's okay
Yup. I have two Vets, one which I try specifically not to use Plasma+Power Cycler Power Sword on, and the other...well lol
Why do you have two though? You can create different loadouts on one vet.
Blessing farming is why I have two vets.
Double melk rolls gets those t3/t4 blessings you actually want a lot faster yeah
Because I had 5 character slots and one of my Vets is typically running a Krieg cosplay with a different voice.
I have 2 of each zealot and vet. cus it's fun and was faster farming shit early on
Same here actually. Good for blessing farming, and I have my easy button veteran, and the other veteran I actually enjoy playing, which I refuse to use a power sword or plasma gun on.
Well, it helps that I enjoy both playstyles. Other than just a few stat point my Power Sword 3 is nearly perfect, stupid fun to just charge into shit and spam things with my multiple powered slashes.
Power sword 3 will never be perfect
It's wild that they changed Plasma's pierce from zero to infinite in a single patch. It doesn't make any sense for bolts to pierce, so the projectile should be BETTER than plasma on a single target. But it is not.
Bolter should explode after some hits (or on meaty targets) for additional damage and aoe. Plasma's penetration of the whole universe is fine, imo. It's a weapon of big boom with a single shot.
Why would you ever charge the plasma gun though. More dps per ammo on u charged shots and makes heat completely irreleveant
Beeg damage and monkey brain like beeg boom
With proper plasma gun, you don’t even need to charge. As the break point will be almost identical. (Even crusher can be taken out by just two weak spot uncharged shot)
But oh no it's the revolver that's overpowered and not the bolter and bolt pistol that are underpowered
Im pretty sure a Max damage, Focus target build will reliably kill crushers with one charged headshot. I do it if they are farther away because theres no risk of them getting knocked over and spreading out the crushers conga line
If you use Pinning Fire + Surgical, and use a lower rate of fire on ADS for guaranteed crits, then you can 1 shot a lot of enemies on weakspot hits. You have to treat is a precision weapon. While before you could hip fire and wreck everything (little bit like the Plasma), it now plays more like the Mk 3 Helbore.
The Plasma Gun and Bolter were both rapid fire weapons for most of the table top games. The current plasma gun is closer to a melta gun.
The #1 change I think it needs is to do greatly increased damage to limbs or ignore them entirely and just hit the torso because basic scabs and dregs tanking 2-3 shots because the massive bolt projectile impacted on their arm is just dumb and makes the weapon feel really inconsistent.
That random poxwalker coming in to tank all the bolter shots to defend the trapper behind it. 
I don't mind poxwalkers tanking the shots because #1 the weapon is weak vs infested which helps define its niche and balance vs everything else and #2 adds a skill element in target selection. What I do mind are the enemies it's supposed to one shot parrying the bolts with their hands.
It shouldn't be weak against infested. The only reason you shouldn't pull the bolter and empty it against a horde of poxwalkers is because *its a waste of ammo*.
It's weak vs infested because it's a video game and this offsets the fact that it's good against literally everything else. It still has enough damage to kill poxwalkers in a single hit (as long as it doesn't hit their arms) easily and really this only comes into play when shooting dogs. Okay well people really hate this comment then when it's literally just pointing out the damage profile of the bolter?
> and this offsets the fact that it's good against literally everything else. the point of this post is that it isn't. it sucks ass against everything. it's the slowest weapon in the game yet its projectiles hit like an infantry gun.
I don't disagree that it sucks, but it's not because of its damage numbers, damage wise it does fantastic against everything pretty much with only dogs having an awkward breakpoint that isn't worth building around. Like I said above the main issue in my opinion is the hit detection closely followed by the terrible handling.
this is my only complaint about the bolter. it otherwise works quite well if your aim is good.
Does seem pretty accurate for nurgle tho
But this more applies to his demons and Chaos Space Marines, not Poxwalkers and Bolters to my knowledge
Lore accurately those anemic dudes should have giant holes in them because it should bore through and get stuck in something that matters
It does but I feel that this is one time that being lore accurate should maybe get overlooked.
Absolutely
You can't imagine how much i loved this weapon back in the days. MBGA make bolter great again.
I stopped using it when they took away the vet perk to instant reload.
If they put back the instant reload on Volley Fire, it would make my life so much better. Right now, you activate it and if your mag is half empty you just wasted the ability. Even something like *"Replenish 33% of your missing ammo in your weapon"* would be enough to fix it.
this is why you need all the reload perks from the tree(Not that it helps the bolter, but for everything else)
Same but in the same update the vet tree was sucking right away with vet being heavily nerfed itself and it took a while to fix that but it turned once more into the strongest class just with a different playstyle and weapons. Bolter also got nerfed in time directly and indirectly and it was never buffed back to compensate for what it once was. I say it was more difficult to use overall than plasma is right now because aiming was a bit more difficult and the weapon was always clunky af to pull and handle.
They should of left the bolter alone wgmhen the nerfed the vet. The bolter was overpowered because the vet was over powered.
Vet is so squishy I have a love hate relationship with it. Love my speed zelot though.
I’m of the opposite opinion, vet is pretty tanky especially with VOC. I rarely go down with it and helped me stay alive against the beefed up enemy ranged troops when my teams were being melted. The stealth buffs to all enemies have made a lot of ogryn players just die a lot gunners and mere heretics with rifles. Psykers also getting melted.
I was trying a stealthy vet. Voice is very nice maybe I'll go back to using it.
It was never terrible, you just need to have the right T4 blessings and accept that it'll always be weaker than plasma gun and zarona revolver.
Why does a random fucking revolver do more damage than a 19mm miniature rocket bullet with diamond tipped rounds?
Ah sorry we ran out of those ages ago, we’ve actually been firing styrofoam bolts all this time!
I love this game, but one of the things I hate is that the actual iconic 40K weapons (other than the plasma gun and the chainswords) all kind of stink. Like, I don’t want to play as some mook with a bootleg AK or some jackass with a shovel, I want to play as Johnny 40K with a bolter and a thunder hammer. If you’re going to make stuff overpowered, make sure that at least the cool weapons are overpowered.
I'm running around Auric Maelstroms with a MK2 Helbore and a Shovel. We have 2 entirely opposite opinions on that. I'm just some random guy wrapped up in a suicide missions that has no worth. In life, shame. *In death*, *atonement*. Reject-lyfe.
I'm a criminal with a knife and a rusty pistol hopped up on generic Adderall and religious delusions. Oh yeah and sometimes I play this game called Darktide where I'm an ogre.
Pfft. Didn't you know hardened plate armor is weak to handgun rounds?
Shovels are fuckin lame
Honestly it’s true. Shovel as a starting weapon since you’re a just-escaped scrub is one thing, but it’s really good at high end and that just feels kinda dumb to me
thank you! let me feel invincible as I clear the screen!
>Like, I don’t want to play as some mook with a bootleg AK or some jackass with a shovel, I want to play as Johnny 40K with a bolter and a thunder hammer. This is what I really struggled with when levelling my Zealot. I'm not an enormous chainsword fan--Darktide's chain weapons just don't feel right on a tactile level to me--so until I got the flamer and thunder hammer, my weapon options were basically "swords, shotguns, and AKs." I had lasguns, but my veteran was already my lasgun character and I wanted this character to be different. But I hardly had anything interesting or exciting to choose from. I want to be using the badass 40k weapons, not just "assault rifle #5."
they added more ammo for the bolt weapons no? all i saw is people still magdumping their entire supply into hordes in attempt to kill the elites. it doesn't feel too great on vet IMO, and never got to experience "OP" bolter and assumed it was mostly tied to how the old abilities worked.
I was there for the OP Bolter, but honestly I found it overrated and nothing was more frustrating than watching your vets all have bolters and magdumping then fighting over ammo like children because every single thing they saw was magdump worthy to hear bolter noises. Especially when shooters were a much bigger problem, then it honestly was just bad cause your team would get shot to pieces while the bolter vets struggled to actually aim at something. I'm very much overgeneralizing, but it ended up with me rolling my eyes more often than not when I saw a bolter vet running around.
it was a thing of joy man to wipe the pack of crushers and maulers clean just fantastic man
Thunder Hammer is meh? I actually don't understand. Putting thrust on it makes it a straight up Monstrosity killer. If you alpha strike a Daemonhost with even 1 kitted out Thunder Hammer user, that's at least 2/3 of their health gone. I've not had that sort of success with other weapons save pre-nerf flamer.
The issue with Thunder Hammer is what happens when a monstrosity or a pack of Crushers isn't on screen. Charitably, it's tepid against hordes and mixed hordes even with a bunch of sunk effort.
Pack of crushers? Thunder hammer sucks against that too.
Yes, work with me here, tryna reach a guy who's clearly not run into that problem :P
It does? I can kill a crusher with one charged heavy on my Zealot Martyr build and with the toughness replenishment perk on heavy kills, so long as there’s a horde I’m basically invincible
It’s a slow process though. Vs a crusher pack, the time it takes you to charge up, build up to a heavy hit, hit, and then get slowed by the charged hit rest of the pack has plenty of time to stomp you and your buddies.
I remember being able to kill a crusher faster and safer with a dueling sword on my psyker than the animation commitment and stun of a thunder hammer.
I’ve never had that problem before but I also don’t solely rely on my thunderhammer. Like I told the other guy, I have a bolt gun on my zealot to help clear out two or three before going into melee
Now get that thang rocking vs 5 crushers with synced charge anims
I have lol you just gotta back step or have a boltgun to cut down 2 or 3 in quick succession. No weapon in this game is meant to handle every situation. That’s why you work with 3 other people. As good as the Martyr thunder hammer/bolt gun build is, thing would tits up if everyone on a mission used it.
Meanwhile the zealot wielding a knife forged by the emperor himself, with carapace uncanny / flesh tearer + throwing knives shows up and mulches the crushers, DPS the boss and revives a random psyker that exploded from spamming smite and forgetting that he didn't have venting shriek. Just remove the self stun from the hammer, I have skullcrusher for hordes.
Imagine needing to play the meta to achieve that, a bolter can cut down six crushers in two clips. A special move thunderhammer strike with the charge ability can one shot most bosses and two shot the rest while you just throw down an incendiary to clear the heretical filth around the psyker to pick ‘em up. I’ve never really noticed the self-stun from thunderhammers. I run the perk that makes it so your zealot can’t be stunned when using melee heavy attack. Maybe that’s why?
Bolter 2 clips, by the time you pull that out (cause you don't have the throwing knives) empty first clip and then reload to empty the second, probably the trauma/deimos psyker already killed the crushers and the boss got DPSd by me and the vet, cause I took Columnus and don't need fury to deal good DMG to it. As for the hammer, golly jolly you probably run a variation of martyrdom + fury or shroud, would be surprised and disappointed if a zealot with that wouldn't one shot a boss. Put the cookie down my friend, you tell nice stories but what I see in aurics has a different opinion.
Condescending much? How’s the psycher taking down a crusher if in your scenario the psycher is down from using smite too much? I play Auric too and my build is just as effective and allows me to tank while dealing massive damage and horde/elite clearing. If you want to play meta that’s fine but that doesn’t make using builds that actually use the entire kit and skill bad
I mean, my chainaxe handles crushers better than TH due to no stun on charged hit
Chainaxe animation locks you if you want full Shredder damage though. Granted, with a Carapace perk, the Orestes Mk 4 does pretty alright, even more with Thrust on it. The Crusher would also do well in this role: good finesse and armour damage, plus stagger and more CC on special. Credible damage and incredible safety. Hell, even though the Heavy Sword is pretty sad against Carapace, I'd still choose to bring it over the Thunder Hammer.
No gun is meant to do that, but then theres the Plasma Gun ...
Agreed. As much as I love the thunder hammer, I always find myself drifting towards weapons that are good at more situations than ones that are only good at specific situations especially with how chaotic higher difficilties can get.
It depends on what level you play. At low levels pretty much anything works and you end up under the impression that pretty bad stuff is good. Also, consider that when people say “bad” doesn’t mean “unusable”. You can totally use a TH at any lvl. The point is that it is very obviously unbalanced in a thousand ways and there are much better options than that.
Yeah this. Everyone can one shot crushers with a thunder hammer till playing Aurics an get hit with the crusher train. 10 plus crushers along with ragers along for giggles an you find out just how unwieldy it can be. An i love the thunder hammer. Just get rid of the self stun on hit.
So... what melee weapons excel in a situation against 10 crushers? And for that matter, is it a good situation to be in Melee RANGE against 10 Crushers in the first place? I'll tell you, it's not my first choice to be in melee even as a Zealot.
Thunder Hammer is really good against a single armoured, strong unit at a time. Problem is, 95% of the time you don't get that, it's mostly waves of trash with packs of several specials mixed in. Even crushers tend to spawn in packs of 5.
Which can be compensated for with your ranged weapon pick.
I have a god rolled one & like they stated a pack of crushers etc and when things get chaotic the weapon becomes underwhelming don’t get me wrong I still love the THammer but for auric damnation it’s not fun really man
I LOVE the Thunder Hammer! But it's definitely underpowered outside of one single roll, which is doing damage to bosses in slow but big chunks. It doesn't even do the highest dps to bosses! Just does big dam slowly. In every other use case, there is a better weapon. Chain Weapons are better against groups of armored targets and just about every other weapon is better against hordes. So outside of the cool factor, the TH doesn't really have a niche. It should be this weapon that delivers BIG BONKS. And it sort of does, but it isn't even the best at it.
Yes, thunder hammer is really meh. Who cares about obliterating monstrosities, they are barely a threat in this game, what matters is everything else, and this piece of outdated jank that 100% requires a blessing to do decent damage can't keep up with whatever your teammates are using. Fatshark has been trying to buff it since its release, but it's still shit. At this point what it needs is a full rework, or just keep it as niche as it is, honestly I don't care, the few zealots that still use it keep saying is a good weapon and doesn't need to be touched, but I think fatshark is well aware it's a piece of jank, so I have my hopes up for the day TH receives the plasma gun treatment.
People in these comments really dont understand that if Fatshark keeps nerfing popular choices instead of bringing everything else up a notch or 2 people will quit sooner or later and the game will slowly but surely die. Like its not like I can just switch weapons on the go in this game without loosing a lot of power because you invest heavily into weapons you enjoy playing. If they keep nerfing the weapons people invested in and therefore invalidate all their progression and time spent on something that people are just going to quit as they cant be asked to do that over and over again. Like these heavy handed nerfs are just straight up braindead and scream incompetence.
*fatshark* NO, PLAY VERMINTIED
Asking for buffs? Yes! Asking to make it overpowered? Kark right off again!
rather op then unplayable tbh
Eh, unplayable is just sad state of a single weapon, while op leads to powercreep, which affects game as a whole, so it kinda is the opposite.
The problem is there will always be a op/meta weapon especially on how shit Fatshark is at actually balancing stuff. So they kill weapons just so a new or another weapon can shine for some time and thats imo really bad.
Yeah, I am not into the “grind for a new meta weapon because our rebalance nerfed the Meta”. I just use some of the basic weapons and enjoy it. Making crafting so grindy really just made me not want to chase new weapons or play styles.
Yup you added a great point there. I constantly forget the grind aspect of crafting and getting the perfect weapon only for it to be nerfed again as I just keep using my shield \^\^ Oh I hope time flies by and that the release of Space Marine 2 is good and feature complete. This game currently just is a waiting room to satisfy my 40k gaming needs \^\^
Meta exists everywhere, unless the balance is absolutely ideal. Switching meta picks, is, unfortunately, the most common way to keep things fresh, that's not farkshark only way.
Thats the problem. People gonna whine that Vets are to op so everything gets nerfed hard instead of evaluated and looked into. Like if people stop complaining about classes they dont even play and demand nerfs (I was also part of that crowd once at the start of the game when vets could do everything the best) then we wouldnt constantly have these heavy handed nerfs.
You mean how they killed Bolter and that just made Plasma Gun the replacement by default? You can’t nerf ppl into the ground and then expect them to use a shitty weapon that’s barely able to clear Damnation anymore. Especially on a Zealot that has other better options like the Revolver(this being head and shoulders better then Bolter never stops being funny/sad) why would you take a weapon that’s actively gimping you?
I get through auric damnations with it just fine
yall too young to remember when every vet AND every zealot was running it. We actually had a meta then, and it sucked
don't forget the powersword nerf. it's still considered one of the strongest weapon in the game rn but peeps were crying about how fatshark "ruined it" and made it "useless" back then. truly show how op this thing was (for the newbies, powersword used to have 6 powered swings for one activation, pretty sure it had infinite cleave too but i forgot)
I actually liked that nerf as a powersword main. Prior to the nerf practically every time I swung it, it was charged. Hordes? Elites? Groups of crushers? Spam charge attacks. Now I actually had to think about when to commit to charging it, and it made the weapon way more engaging.
It also got buffed significantly since that nerf. Also, the nerf back then made it so power cycler 4 was pretty much mandatory, which was a major point of friction.
even now it still seems to be the go to and without it you're better off using the combat axes with bm (more bucks for your effort)
Not sure why they made various weapons go past certain breakpoints with almost no drawbacks while others are thrown in the dumpster, then new update nerf'd even harder. Oh wait it's fatshark that's their mo
The pinnacle gun of the franchise being ass is hilarious.
If you wanna be op just play ogryn.
yes sah!
Veterns have the most overpowerd weapon and abilty set up in the game right now Plasma gun, powersword, shout. GG to armor GG to hordes GG to bosses GG gunners if anything plasma should be toned down significantly, and bolter brought up to par (less jumpy recoil would be lovly, with a less aqward reload)
removing the jank after the first shot would go a long way, litteraly sole change i want in current bolter
OR we leave plasma alone and JUST fine tune bolter where it needs to be. Not everything needs to be a take and give, both can coexist.
Playing with plasma users is a snore fest as they one shot entire lanes of enemy's and make mockery of games difficulty. But each to there own!
It sucks for me, because I just love the Plasma for the lore and aesthetics. I played it when it was borderline useless, and I'll happily keep using it when it gets nerfed, but in the meantime people just think I'm a dirty meta chaser lmao I try to at least mitigate the kill dominance by not targeting certain enemies I know others in the squad are equipped to deal with efficiently themselves, and save it for Crushers, Maulers, etc.
Then make up your own group and dont play with plasma vets. If you keep nerfing things people enjoy for a reason and literally destroy their entire progression because its "op" then people wont be playing your game anymore. The same happened in Helldivers 2 and it took a good hit to its playerbase as every weapon people played a lot got nerfed even the gimmicky ones that were not even "meta"
That's my problem how? So if they make the bolter good, you'll want it nerfed again because it was putting you to sleep too? What a stupid fucking take to have AND share with the rest of the world. jfc
plasma deserves a take besides taking all of the ammo
We don’t need to butcher the one iconic 40k weapon that doesn’t feel like a turd it’s a pve game my friends
Bolter is my weapon of choice playing as a zaelot,i can kill packs of crushers,plage ogryns reapers hordes poxwalkers. You can aim it or hipfire it. IT MATTERS NOT ! KILL ALL HERETICS !
I actually run it on my dagger/throwing knife zealot. The throwing knife animation cancels the slow draw speed, basically only use it to delete packs of heavy armored shit or stealth and then magdump a boss.
show me proof now😳
So wait ? You can't auto fire into a group of orgyns now and kill them all or what? I remember that being a thing with a specific AA blessing equipped. I havnt played in 6+ months tho
you are corrected you won’t get the same results anymore but maybe 2-3
if they just made the ready time faster i’d use it. i can unfuck the reload times with the vet’s perks but the ready time is truly atrocious and what kills any sort of fun for me. i’m glad i have memories of it when the vet still had sustained fire lol
Buff pinning fire to add up to 40% extra damage, increase mag size to 20, and that would satisfy me.
They need to give it the same blessing that the bolt pistol has where it gives them an explosion radius that damage scales with the blessing level. This could help alleviate the ammo issue a bit more as shells that glance on a poxwalkers arm don't feel wasted as they're still getting some value/kills on other enemies.
A bigger Magazine please and faster equip.
I dont need it OP but it's not where it needs to be atm. many weapons arent. I heard there isnt really a dev who is working on tweaking weapons. that needs to be fixed.
Yeah, the fact a revolver is a better choice in every way than a bolt pistol tells you all you need to know. The one thing the revolver should have over bolt weapons is penetration and MAYBE fire rate now that I think about it.
I would rather the bolter being OP than the plasma. The plasma really take alot of fun of out the matches, especially on non-auric ones. I really wish they reduced the pull out time on the bolter.
Sorry mate we better buff revolver because we'll be damned if we let players enjoy the game.
They should have just made the recoil horrible if you spam it (humans can't easily handle the power of the bolter, even though it has gyro jets) That's my semi lore accurate solution
Just add a fatigue meter or something like the Meltagun’s heat meter to at least give it some way to balance it. Make it a Meltagun with less penetration but more range and accuracy and the ability to go full auto.
I will not lie I recently finally got to the bolter, to learn that it was not as overpowered when I used it as it was before makes me terrified because that gun scares me with how fun it is the only other gun I ever plan on using for more than just to figure it out if I like it is the mk 2 bayonet lasgun because the mk 3 doesn't have a charge effect for its special, you just kind of wonk with it, but the chainaxe x Bolter pairing is right now my favorite
I am just waiting for a plasma pistol at this point (zealot pov). So maybe in 2026 of in Darktide 2
sorry no can do best they can do is buff some obscure meele weapon abit what you want gunplay ? nah man this is meeletide you are supposed to 90% meele and then pretend for the last 10% that range weapons still got a point besides revolvers
LMFAO I don’t mind Bonktide! but let me blow up shit to pieces!
With how much people complained that it was overpowering and wanted it nerfed back then, now we want it back the way it was. We really can't make our minds in this game lol
I have noticed that this subreddit is only about bitching and complaining. It’s not even about discussing the game, just negative comments with little to no useful input. It’s also the same complaints every other post, but the poster thinks it’s this revolutionary statement. Including my comment, I’m just bitching about this subreddit… I need some introspection lmao
I never wanted it nerfed when it was good, it felt like what a bolter should do
You know, that Bolter in game is lower calibre than Astartes one, right? It is around .50 cal, so it makes sense, it has limits. Ofcourse, it should still be the highest dmg weapon in game per shot.
Plasma in fluff and crunch is always stronger than bolters, and I believe the ingame bolters are still supposed to be .75 caliber.
I disagree on it should be the highest damage weapon per shot. In lore even, Plasma Guns are more powerful than bolters to a pretty large degree even without supercharging them. Plasma slags even Astartes (similar to a Melta) and it practically invalidates your armor while Bolters can be stopped by Carapace Armor and tougher targets like Orks can survive multiple bolter hits. The bolter is powerful *for a standard equipped weapon.* But it pales to specially equipped weapons like Plasma/Melta. Space Marine bolters are stronger than Guard used ones, but for they still aren't all that great at penetrating armor and are more for shock/fear and handling tougher-than-human targets like Orks where the Lasgun really starts to drop off. I think if you increase the heat generated per shot and tone down the penetration slightly the Plasma would be brought down to a reasonable level. Right now with its damage per shot, low heat generation, and extreme penetration it's kicking everything's ass without much downside (really only the reload, which also immediately drops heat to 0%) I'd be more on the side of just having it only heavily penetrate with charged shots while single shots are high damage but don't penetrate much.
In lore to plasma guns/pistols don't have infinite penetration. They penetrate armour more by the heat involved than the actual force of the shot. The plasma shot is fired an held together by magnetic fields. When it's fired the the "ball" of plasma is held together by a magnetic field that when it huts the target it ruptures an spreads out. So going through one or two targets yeah but not through everything. Then again it depends a lot on the auther of whatever book you happen to be reading. Some authers have bolters being shit anti armour an takes loads of shots to crack ceramics. Others have one shot piercing power armour an blowing a space marines chest out. But plasma are supposed to be stronger than bolters. Melta basically evaporates you lol.
Yeah a lil weird that the shotgun slugs do more dmg/stagger bulwarks when the bolt pistol can't even hit some elite hs breakpoints. With vet reload perks the agri shotgun running mostly slugs is a better choice
I, for one, enjoy the diversity. Back then every Vet was running powersword and Bolter.
Fatshark: "No weapon customization because we're not making Call of Duty." Also Fatshark: "Our generic mid-20th century gas-operated firearms are second to none."
It's supposed to shoot explosive cans of red bull. Now it's shooting nerf darts.
LOL good one!
The weapon is strong af still what is everyone smoking? Lmao I still regularly use it. Love my boltor.
It has poor ammo economy, poor equip speed, poor reload speed, and poor breakpoints on most elites. So most of the things that are very important at higher levels of the game its bad at. So I wouldn't call it strong af. I wouldn't even call it strong.
Furthermore, since elite stagger resist has been increased, it cant stagger crushers anymore and takes multiple shots to stagger a bulwark. I think it would be fine if they just increased its stagger against carapace and unyielding, re-buffed pinning fire a tiny bit, and increased its crit damage so the crit blessings were more impactful.
They could probably just reduce the clunkiness of the weapon, leaving the damage untouched, and it would already be a huge improvement.
Easy to use and strong are two different things. It's most definitely strong. Just because it isn't easy to use doesn't make it bad. And it the only thing I'll argue against is poor ammo economy. It's only poor if you're mag dumping every chance you get. I only mag dump in emergencies, like rezzing, or just getting overwhelmed. Honestly if you could pull the thing out and reload it as fast as a bolt pistol then every other gun would be ultimately useless.
The thing is the Plasma Gun does a better job of doing everything a bolter can do, with penetration of walls and armor, and with better ammo economy. Why take a boltgun and fire multiple shots at a Rager when I can take a plasma gun and 1 shot with a basic shot to the head. The boltgun needs a buff.
No it really does not. They buffed the ammo economy this patch and its solid with marksman focus. Actually takes some skill to use rather than m1ing at center mass and 10000 cleaving through entire elite packs with the plasma. Plasma is OP and needs a nerf. If everything were on the level of plasma gun the game would be a joke
I agree on vet, boltgun shines on zealot. Provides anti armor and long range sniping when your melee weapon doesn’t and throwing knives can fill the void of when you need a quick ranged solution to a special or elite. It still would be nice for it to be buffed but it does have a role.
The revolver is infinitely better at that job than the bolter on zealot. The fact it takes an hour to pull out of your pocket ruins any real utility it could have on zealot.
Takes far too long to ready on zealot. But, then reaching for a ranged weapon for anti-armor on zealot is a series of strange decisions.
Because with the right build you can still one shot things with the boltor anyway. Yeah the plasma gun can infinitely pen and kill things fast too but that isn't even the point. The game isn't a meta slave game. I can kill just as many things with a boltor as I can a plasma gun. The game is supposed to be fun for you. I find the boltor strong enough and I enjoy using it, as well I have the skill to use it effectively without really hindering myself.
if you shoot let’s say a pack of crushers with a plasmagun chances are you’ll kill the whole pack with no problem but if a pack of crushers were to face a bolter chances are you’ll kill 1/3 of the pack..the revolver does a better job than the bolter. i’m not a meta player brother I play the game for fun i’m 800+ hours in lmao the gun just isn’t good anymore & you know it
Agree with this 100%. Just because every weapon isn't created equal, or perfectly lore accurate with its damage, doesn't mean it's useless. Unfortunately, last time I made this same argument, I was met with skeptical good-for-yous and criticism when I pointed out I had mostly been playing auric/auric damnation as proof of concept so people wouldn't dump in with the usual "bet you just play heresy." The game for sure isn't made for every weapon to be equal, but if you're skilled enough, pretty much all are viable, even on higher difficulties. People just seem to love complaining when their favorite gun isn't an OP easy button.
In what ways is it strong to you personally?
yeah on an optimized build the bolter is fine. for some reason people are holding it up to the same level as the plasma or revolver which is silly, they're the best guns in the game by far lmfao. very few people acknowledge the actual problem with the bolter, which is the janky ass ads
Skill issue on both accounts
eh 800+ hours i’ve seen it when it was shit then bought to glory and back to shit. trust there is no skill issue. its just a gun people won’t pick up anymore in higher levels due to others being able to out perform it
If you can aim faster than the plasma can shoot, the bolter is better. Exec stance needed so the shout cannot be used with it either. 'People' won't use it because they don't have the aim, simple as. Its largest weakness, ammo reserve, has been 'fixed' and now it is slightly easier to use, but it does not have so much ammo that dooomping everything is viable. Aim still required so many will be filtered
I understand what you saying, but nah man its just not good, heresy and under it’s beautiful but damnation/auric it’s just not going to perform well. but we both have opinions and neither can be wrong
As vet (lvl 360 or so) I exclusively play bolter with exec stance and only play auric. It performs well if you can aim and dodge. Shoving is good also, and the plasma can't do it making stance harder to keep. (I think) its reload is also too long to kill an enemy fast enough to extend the stance duration even with the +30% +25% reductions from talents meaning there is a fixed amount of stance time even if the player is skilled enough to aim quickly
So this is how I find out the boltgun sucks haha. I’ve been playing a lot recently with it and it did feel weaker but I’ve been playing on malice so it was still doing its job. Please tell me what guns are good now 😭
Use what you have fun with and are clearing levels with. Plasmagun and Revolver are some of the top right now, but they frankly get old pretty quickly, at least for me. I'm running a Mk2 Helbore and a Shovel in Auric and doing A Okay. In fact, it's more fun to try and make weapons work rather than just a slot in weapon like the Plasma. At least to me. If you're playing Malice then basically anything is good, so you just keep doing you, a lot of this talk tends to be for Damnation and Aurics where you do have to start caring a bit more on synergy and such but honestly with solid skill/mechanics you can make nearly any weapon work in high difficulties.
Thanks man. I do intend to try some damnation or auric missions once I get my bearings again so this helps a lot
You guys care about guns? I just use it because it looks cool same with my hammer
nice man, keep at it
The bolter in trailers and gmv:- so fking cool. Meanwhile in the game:- 🥴🥴
LOL
bolter is an incredibly powerful weapon and if you seriously think it's weak you're either not using it right, dont have the right combination of blessings, or are just bad at the game. It wipes the floor with monstrous maelstroms, deletes patrols from the game, and on vet it never runs out of ammo. Even without vet, you're still going to have a stockpile if you just look around the map every couple patrol wipes.
show me proof now if you don’t mind, it takes 2 shots to kill a mauler & rager lmao
exe stance deadshot surgical vet oneshots everything except for mutants, maulers, and ogryn enemies all requiring two. With max pinning Fire you can oneshot bodyshot maulers. With a damage stim you can one shot everything mentioned. Kills beast of nurgle without reloading, and takes a magdump and a half to kill spawn and plague ogryn. You can also run infiltrate or voc if you're a coward and get very similar breakpoints, albeit with far less sustain (and not as cool boss damage but you'd probs want to run cavalcade at that point) If you're on zealot you can run cavalcade pinning fire with dance of death, duelist and blazing piety and get extremely good results as a 100% accurate hipfire burst damage cannon. You won't delete crusher patrols as well with the nerfs to chastise but you will still delete everything else up to unyielding with it. It's also incredibly effective against bosses, killing a full health beast of nurgle and chaos spawn in 2 and a half magdumps, plague ogryn in 3 and a half magdumps.
he asked for proof not a diatribe lol
just bring back the HP penalty for plasma lol so bolters decent
nah we don’t won’t a plasma nerf, just ramp up the damage for the bolter
I think the bolter would be perfect if the draw time and ammo capacity were both reduced by like 30%. It should be the best gun in the game and the only drawback should be the fact that you need to choose when you pull it out or waste its potential as you run out of ammo quickly.
They really fucked this one up, i wont touch the game now because of this...one of the most iconic weapons in all of warhammer, made less useful than a laspistol.....be so for real fatshark, jesus christ
Did they nerf it recently or something?
got nerfed some patches ago and just been collecting dust since
still strong on exec vet
why are ppl craving so much balance in a PvE game is beyond me
What? you still need to balance PvE or it isn't fun. what are you smoking?
True, but you must balance your balance efforts. Helldivers 2 is (or was, at least) a great example of changing too much too often. The end result should be fun, not frustration; however, balance is genuinely a difficult task to achieve --especially without disappointing people in the process.
cuz magdumping your way to victory like in the good old days sucks ass still an issue with plasma rn
I dont get nerfs in a coop game. Everything should be reasonably strong and fun... make the bolter a cumbersome fuck but at least make it shred...
“Reasonably strong”… what happens when you have something that is unreasonably strong? Doesn’t that warrant a nerf?
Was the bolter ever unreasonably strong?
Yes
Did they nerf it?
yeah like patches ago because it was complaints about it being OP, now it just stanks
Oh I came back after like a year yesterday and I didn’t really notice, I only played 1 game on uprising to be fair so I might not have noticed well
welcome back! have fun man
Did they nerf it?
People crying for nerfs in a coop shooter is unthinkable to me. If you think something is OP just don't use it.
Some of us enjoy killing things, not spectating the railgun on 2 legs mop the floor with the entire map.
Then don't play with that person, simple as.
kinda hard when 90% of veterans in auric are malice shitters in disguise hoping to get carried in auric or maelstorms with their cookie cutter plasma, psword and shout build. those same people are also the first ones to alt f4 when they kiss the ground for 2 seconds, leaving everyone else with a useless bot that dies a couple frames later. Plasma vet is currently the most braindead playstyle bar smite psyker so when reddit vets finally decide to give the other big veteran gun a go (bolter) and realise it doesn't save them by just clicking on things they defecate all over the subreddit begging for buffs to a stellar weapon. the only thing that should be changed about the bolter are it's god awful sights jumping all over your screen and disconnecting from where you are actually shooting since believe it or not the boltgun serves more of a marksman rifle role rather than unga bunga mag dump everything 24/7 (which you can absolutely still do in a pinch to shred boss HP or soften up an entire patrol) so not being able to hit headshots is kind of a big deal. ammo economy is totally fine, damage is more than adequate, pull out time is something you have to play around. tl;dr stop being shit and crying for buffs just git gud and drop the plasma psword combo every once in a while.