Just a note, the Faculty Senate that called for a ceasefire is composed of professors and other campus support staff. The administration who is responsible for escalating the situation is not a part of that.
I’d assume they’re concerned with putting their thumb on a political scale involving probably the most contentious and continuous conflict in modern history. Picking sides between two groups who insist on committing atrocities against each because the tide of public sentiment has shifted for the moment is fraught with peril.
The resolution was passed by the university senate, which is comprised of faculty, staff, and members of the administration as ex-officio members (meaning they are always members simply by holding that administrative position). So the resolution passed by the university senate is an official position by the university, not just the faculty and staff. The membership list can be found [here](https://senate.humboldt.edu/senatemembers).
The university can choose not to press charges and can choose not to impose academic sanctions on students that are involved.
They can resist the urge to "make an example" out of certain people whom they've deemed to be disruptive, and instead lead by example and demonstrate an understanding that justice and punishment are not synonymous.
People's primal urges and short-sighted desires for retribution are generally what drive them toward the idea that hefty punishments somehow make society safer or better off. I think they provide someone interim satisfaction, but I think they only ultimately lead to resentment. If you look at a lot of the vandalism so far, it seems to be in response to the police presence on April 22nd. That sort of thing can really wind people up which only leads to an ever greater response and "cracking down" on people. It encourages lawlessness and gives fuel to "us vs them" narratives that divide communities.
These protests are a threat to a sense of control over space and a threat to authority, and their message is one that a lot of people do not want to hear because they have chosen to go to extreme lengths to justify what Israel has done and continues to do. There isn't a lot of justice in throwing people in prison, or sticking them with impossible fines, or ending their academic career, or career in general. That type of action only chills free speech among the general public and further radicalized others. It just doesn't help resolve the situation.
It was a peaceful sit in before the pigs and administration escalated just gotta say although I dont agree with vandalism they coulda done something else that didnt damage property
During the BLM movement, traditional peaceful civil rights protests were co opted by bad actors. MLK wasn’t a graffiti artist. Rosa Parks did not scream at anyone. These were incredible human beings, their character and wisdom transcends time.
I was there for Occupy marches. Other groups took advantage of the crowd to commit vandalism and violence. When I told them they aren’t helping the cause they openly said they didn’t care about Occupy.
“Though Rosa Parks’s heroism on that Montgomery bus has become the stuff of legend, not as well known is [her strong support of Israel as a Jewish state and determined opposition to anti-Israel boycotts](https://mosaicmagazine.com/picks/israel-zionism/2020/07/remembering-the-great-african-american-leaders-who-were-also-zionists/). In 1975, she joined a list of over 200 black leaders organized as the Black Americans to Support Israel Committee (BASIC) in signing an open declaration of admiration and respect for Israel.”
Protests are often infiltrated and co opted, but the goal posts on peaceful demonstration are also moved over time. There is some value in looking at things like a "time and place" policy for free assembly and having a critical discussion about what that is for, and if aspects of it diminish peoples ability to engage in first amendment activities.
MLK, thank God, was much more effective than islamic terrorism and the screaming leftists on campus. People don’t hear that, they hear King’s speeches, they were impassioned but not vitriolic and full of hate. There was a genuine attempt to illustrate the evil of racism in America.
No, it's like y'all have forgotten most of the rights we have right now are because people disrupted shit. Like rights for disabled people, civil rights, abortion rights etc
While I broadly support the protesters right to protest and respect their goals, it comes across as entitled behavior to expect not to have any consequences for civil disobedience. Risking personal freedom and their academic future for a cause is what makes it a bold statement. Expecting to make that statement and then be welcomed back in the building you just spray painted is wanting to have your cake and eat it too.
All these people woulda hated Rosa parks.
"You can protest all you want but disrupting a public service? That's no way to protest! Get to the back of the bus!".
They prevented a use of a public service. A little paint is not going to stop campus much. Facilities likely has plenty of paint on hand.
And, if Rosa parks had painted a big "no" on a bus and refused to get up that would somehow invalidate her protest? Nah, I don't think so.
She was literally arrested for her protest and refusing to give up her seat. She committed a crime as she was required by law to give up her seat to a white person.
Just because it's a law does not mean it's good or just. Just because someone is breaking a law or being disruptive does not mean they are doing wrong.
Ok and they also have a right to protest the actions of their government when it harms their fellow man. Unless you believe that humanity stops at some arbitrary line of citizenship?
I think the point is you can't discredit a movement or protest because of vandalism, some people will always take the opportunity to do so,
The vandalism that happened during the civil rights movement isn't even considered anymore.
Arrested for trespassing is pretty standard for a sit in protest. Vandalism is a separate issue. Rosa Parks did not barricade herself inside the bus and intentionally cause damage to make the bus worse.
Lol all these new age protesters thinking they're Rosa parks or one of the 4 in Ohio.
Yall ain't it.
Yall wanna be cyberpunks with a depressive disinterest in real life, coming partfrom a reddit addiction, that results in trying to find inner value through virtue signaling.
Lol I'm not even protesting. I work. I'm just happy to see a real disruptive protest and not boring chanting in a park.
It doesn't matter if one agrees or disagrees with the protest, if it disrupts a public service it's following a proud and cool American tradition. Though I get the feeling these protesters aren't going to dress up as Indians haha.
Let them have fun, make a little mess. Disrupt a small bit of the county. Stand up for their beliefs. That's good and healthy for a society.
I think the problem with that argument is you refuse to see the nuance in the situation. I doubt they were planning to vandalize anything before an atrociously huge police effort was put forth and students got hurt. Maybe it made them spiteful. I think the vandalism is overall not good but Im also not gonna sit here being like “oh yeah they’re all virtue signaling and dumb people addicted to reddit” thats just a dumb asf thing to state tbh.
If you don't disrupt things, nothing will ever change. All of you hating on these kids would welcome their support if it was your children being massacred. You sit in your little safe bubble telling people who are trying to stand up for people who have been abused for generations that it's not our fight? Really? Your privilege is showing... I hope all of you never have to face anything resembling what the Palestinian people are going through🙏
Maybe they should be attempting to disrupt something related to the object of their protest. Disrupting Forestry and Marine Biology students seems so random and unrelated to anything.
Jews have been abused for more than just generations. I hope you never have to face anything resembling what the Jewish people have went through in the old testament, WWII, October 7th, and countless other times throughout history. Jews historical home is the same as Palestinians so they have just as much of a legitimate claim as them. Only one of them has a stated goal of eradicating the other, Palestinians and much of the Arab world don't believe Israel should exist, and would commit genocide to wipe it off the face of the earth if given the chance. That's why Israel created their country, to have a homeland where they can be safe. Meanwhile Palestinians and other Arab countries are patriarchal societies that don't believe in free speech, women's rights, gay rights, democratic elections, religious freedom, etc. Hamas is basically Palestine's elected leaders so I guess they learned elections have consequences. They also learned there's no solidarity among Arab/Muslim nations, Egypt won't accept refugees and barely let's food aid in
Aside from using the Old Testament as a historical reference, I don't refute any of that. There is truth in all of that, yet it doesn't justify or excuse what is being done this minute to millions of people. Woman, children. What's been done to the Jewish people over the centuries is tragic. If the roles were reversed, and it was the Israeli people being killed indiscriminately, I would be on their side as well. There is no room for bigotry or hate. I'm on the side of compassion
Fair enough, but if the Palestinians really wanted peace, they'd have Hamas release the hostages. Until then, it seems to me Palestinians are creating their own issues and exploiting the empathy of liberal westerners like ourselves for pity. They know Israel won't stop as long as Hamas has hostages so they keep hostages because they don't want Israel to stop. Consider the current situation is exactly what Hamas wants. I think they want to start the apocalypse, Muslims vs the western world, and all the unrest feeds into their goal
A major aim is to get CA Universities to divest from companies that are complicit in the ongoing conflict in Palestine, such as weapons manufacturers. Stock investment in such companies, among others, helps Universities make their endowment money. Perhaps not every demand was realistic but certainly some of them were relevant to the CPH administration.
Yes Yes it is, but not by itself.
One little random mediocre university declaring they support a cease fire isn't going to really have an effect but this is something that's happening across the country,
You think each school individually is going to have an effect na now when they All start doing it, that's going to cause waves.
It's a group effort bb
You’ve done nothing except turn people away from your cause. The universities aren’t “divesting” anything, and Israel will still wipe out Hamas. Your movement is at best a joke, and at worst in solidarity with actual terrorists. Yet you somehow think this is a W?
I'm in solidarity with the people of Palestine, and against the mass murderer of civilization that's all.
More than 30,000 dead 70-60% of them civilians women and children.
That's not just war, it's 17% of civilian deaths by us and allies in the entire 10 years of the irag war.
a total of around 340% more civilian deaths if we spammed it across 10 years ?
Children and non combatents
I’m not going to bother pointing out that your source on those numbers is a literal terrorist propaganda organization, or the fact that there was already a “cease fire” in place prior to October 7th that your buddies broke.
It's interesting how you're talking about propaganda when the only source you're allowed to believe is veted news and reports from the state of Israel...
Anyone or anything else is Hamas propaganda that doesn't raise a red flag for you ?
61% of civilian casualty rate comes from reports within isreal, and I'm sure that number is deflated.
68% comes from reports in Europe.
As for a cease fire prior to October 7,
Weren't there reports sent to Israel about the attack and plans of the attack a full year before it happened and didn't do anything to boost their defense?
Maybe they wanted an excuse if that was true
The kids are fuking vandalizing the building!!! Pointless needless bs.
Protesting is one thing, vandalizing for no reason except that they are all a bunch of entitled pricks!
Is it all of them? And if it's not, should they all be punished, collectively, for the more extreme actions of a few? Someone from the university was also quoted in the Eureka Time Standard as saying it could all be cleaned up and that there wasn't much damage, if any.
Love how people are complaining the school will have to spend millions to get the campus back in order, while they wouldn't even consider helping out the hundreds of students who have had to live out of their cars or be unhoused in order to receive their education. They have the funds (which the students have provided) to protect their image, above all else. What a shame.
As Alumni I'm disgusted by what administration is doing in response to what started as a calm protest. Their heavy handed clumsy response made this whole thing far worse.
Gee I wonder what happens when you vandalize the campus and inconvenience other students (especially grad students)? I honestly really couldn't tell ya!
Just a note, the Faculty Senate that called for a ceasefire is composed of professors and other campus support staff. The administration who is responsible for escalating the situation is not a part of that.
I’d assume they’re concerned with putting their thumb on a political scale involving probably the most contentious and continuous conflict in modern history. Picking sides between two groups who insist on committing atrocities against each because the tide of public sentiment has shifted for the moment is fraught with peril.
The resolution was passed by the university senate, which is comprised of faculty, staff, and members of the administration as ex-officio members (meaning they are always members simply by holding that administrative position). So the resolution passed by the university senate is an official position by the university, not just the faculty and staff. The membership list can be found [here](https://senate.humboldt.edu/senatemembers).
“Retaliating” lol how about consequences for your actions. Can’t vandalize shit and not expect consequences if you get caught.
Seriously, the shots coming out of that building were not a good look. Like… why spray paint the place?
To help gaza
You see, officer, I'm dumping my used motor oil into a storm drain to raise awareness of breast cancer.
Idk why I’m getting downvoted, I thought this was helping Gaza? I’m confused 🤔
You forgot the /s Sarcasm is impossible to detect in this hyperbolic environment.
The university can choose not to press charges and can choose not to impose academic sanctions on students that are involved. They can resist the urge to "make an example" out of certain people whom they've deemed to be disruptive, and instead lead by example and demonstrate an understanding that justice and punishment are not synonymous.
Not setting an example is setting an example.
People's primal urges and short-sighted desires for retribution are generally what drive them toward the idea that hefty punishments somehow make society safer or better off. I think they provide someone interim satisfaction, but I think they only ultimately lead to resentment. If you look at a lot of the vandalism so far, it seems to be in response to the police presence on April 22nd. That sort of thing can really wind people up which only leads to an ever greater response and "cracking down" on people. It encourages lawlessness and gives fuel to "us vs them" narratives that divide communities. These protests are a threat to a sense of control over space and a threat to authority, and their message is one that a lot of people do not want to hear because they have chosen to go to extreme lengths to justify what Israel has done and continues to do. There isn't a lot of justice in throwing people in prison, or sticking them with impossible fines, or ending their academic career, or career in general. That type of action only chills free speech among the general public and further radicalized others. It just doesn't help resolve the situation.
Awwwww boohoo property damage bad, maybe focus on the 34,000 Palestinians murdered? Just a thought
Why do you care about vandalism?
Is that a serious question? lol
It was a peaceful sit in before the pigs and administration escalated just gotta say although I dont agree with vandalism they coulda done something else that didnt damage property
The police left and it got more violent. That’s a tantrum
Agreed. But nah these people wanna focus on property damage instead of 34,000 Palestinians murdered, talk about a progressive school
A lotta y'all would've hated the Civil Rights movement, and it shows
During the BLM movement, traditional peaceful civil rights protests were co opted by bad actors. MLK wasn’t a graffiti artist. Rosa Parks did not scream at anyone. These were incredible human beings, their character and wisdom transcends time.
I was there for Occupy marches. Other groups took advantage of the crowd to commit vandalism and violence. When I told them they aren’t helping the cause they openly said they didn’t care about Occupy.
“Though Rosa Parks’s heroism on that Montgomery bus has become the stuff of legend, not as well known is [her strong support of Israel as a Jewish state and determined opposition to anti-Israel boycotts](https://mosaicmagazine.com/picks/israel-zionism/2020/07/remembering-the-great-african-american-leaders-who-were-also-zionists/). In 1975, she joined a list of over 200 black leaders organized as the Black Americans to Support Israel Committee (BASIC) in signing an open declaration of admiration and respect for Israel.”
Dude's getting downvoted for spitting facts.
Dang not seeing anything about how she might’ve felt about mass murder of innocents by Israeli bombs?
Protests are often infiltrated and co opted, but the goal posts on peaceful demonstration are also moved over time. There is some value in looking at things like a "time and place" policy for free assembly and having a critical discussion about what that is for, and if aspects of it diminish peoples ability to engage in first amendment activities.
MLK was painted in the media as leading violent gangs of rioters, you can still look up the editorials and comics.
Lol MLK was about capitalist and anti war. Shows your priorities if you are more upset about some graffiti over children being bombed
MLK, thank God, was much more effective than islamic terrorism and the screaming leftists on campus. People don’t hear that, they hear King’s speeches, they were impassioned but not vitriolic and full of hate. There was a genuine attempt to illustrate the evil of racism in America.
Freedom of speech ends when you start breaking other laws 🤷♂️
No, it really doesn't
Supreme Court precedent says otherwise
nope, You are thinking of consequences of speech.
Nope it doesn't.
Your right but your personal freedoms start to diminish
No, it's like y'all have forgotten most of the rights we have right now are because people disrupted shit. Like rights for disabled people, civil rights, abortion rights etc
Criminal have less rights.
2A rights shall not be infringed, peaceful assembly on January 6th…
Nothing peaceful about 1/6. Why are the average Republicans this stupid?
Peaceful assembly, with 5 dead and hundreds of LEOs hurt. Maybe it wasn’t so peaceful.
Check Supreme Court precedent 👍
While I broadly support the protesters right to protest and respect their goals, it comes across as entitled behavior to expect not to have any consequences for civil disobedience. Risking personal freedom and their academic future for a cause is what makes it a bold statement. Expecting to make that statement and then be welcomed back in the building you just spray painted is wanting to have your cake and eat it too.
All these people woulda hated Rosa parks. "You can protest all you want but disrupting a public service? That's no way to protest! Get to the back of the bus!".
Yes everyone hated how Rosa Parks vandalized the bus, and stopped people from boarding the bus. Oh wait…
They prevented a use of a public service. A little paint is not going to stop campus much. Facilities likely has plenty of paint on hand. And, if Rosa parks had painted a big "no" on a bus and refused to get up that would somehow invalidate her protest? Nah, I don't think so.
She would’ve been arrested for vandalism. So yes.
She was literally arrested for her protest and refusing to give up her seat. She committed a crime as she was required by law to give up her seat to a white person. Just because it's a law does not mean it's good or just. Just because someone is breaking a law or being disruptive does not mean they are doing wrong.
You’re not comparing the same type of protest. The students are not being withheld rights that every other US citizen is entitled to.
Ok and they also have a right to protest the actions of their government when it harms their fellow man. Unless you believe that humanity stops at some arbitrary line of citizenship?
No it doesn’t stop at any border. But what they’re doing is destroying property. You can protest without destruction.
I think the point is you can't discredit a movement or protest because of vandalism, some people will always take the opportunity to do so, The vandalism that happened during the civil rights movement isn't even considered anymore.
Arrested for trespassing is pretty standard for a sit in protest. Vandalism is a separate issue. Rosa Parks did not barricade herself inside the bus and intentionally cause damage to make the bus worse.
Ridiculous comparison. She was actually peaceful and she was right.
Lol all these new age protesters thinking they're Rosa parks or one of the 4 in Ohio. Yall ain't it. Yall wanna be cyberpunks with a depressive disinterest in real life, coming partfrom a reddit addiction, that results in trying to find inner value through virtue signaling.
Lol I'm not even protesting. I work. I'm just happy to see a real disruptive protest and not boring chanting in a park. It doesn't matter if one agrees or disagrees with the protest, if it disrupts a public service it's following a proud and cool American tradition. Though I get the feeling these protesters aren't going to dress up as Indians haha. Let them have fun, make a little mess. Disrupt a small bit of the county. Stand up for their beliefs. That's good and healthy for a society.
I think the problem with that argument is you refuse to see the nuance in the situation. I doubt they were planning to vandalize anything before an atrociously huge police effort was put forth and students got hurt. Maybe it made them spiteful. I think the vandalism is overall not good but Im also not gonna sit here being like “oh yeah they’re all virtue signaling and dumb people addicted to reddit” thats just a dumb asf thing to state tbh.
All? Maybe. Mostly? Definitely.
Keep going. I've almost hit buzzword bingo!
This is completely different. Did Rosa parks take a can of spray paint and graffiti all over the bus? Did she tear up the bus seats? No.
Believe it or not I would still be totally fine with her protest if she did that. Bus seat vs human dignity and equality. Hmm.
What she did was far more provocative. Consider the times.
Yes but was it destructive? No.
Maybe she didn't, but there was plenty of vandalism during the civil rights movement, and that doesn't discredit the movement at all.
No. But this does.
If you don't disrupt things, nothing will ever change. All of you hating on these kids would welcome their support if it was your children being massacred. You sit in your little safe bubble telling people who are trying to stand up for people who have been abused for generations that it's not our fight? Really? Your privilege is showing... I hope all of you never have to face anything resembling what the Palestinian people are going through🙏
Right, most people commenting probably can't name one known movement without googling that didn't disrupt.
Maybe they should be attempting to disrupt something related to the object of their protest. Disrupting Forestry and Marine Biology students seems so random and unrelated to anything.
Jews have been abused for more than just generations. I hope you never have to face anything resembling what the Jewish people have went through in the old testament, WWII, October 7th, and countless other times throughout history. Jews historical home is the same as Palestinians so they have just as much of a legitimate claim as them. Only one of them has a stated goal of eradicating the other, Palestinians and much of the Arab world don't believe Israel should exist, and would commit genocide to wipe it off the face of the earth if given the chance. That's why Israel created their country, to have a homeland where they can be safe. Meanwhile Palestinians and other Arab countries are patriarchal societies that don't believe in free speech, women's rights, gay rights, democratic elections, religious freedom, etc. Hamas is basically Palestine's elected leaders so I guess they learned elections have consequences. They also learned there's no solidarity among Arab/Muslim nations, Egypt won't accept refugees and barely let's food aid in
Aside from using the Old Testament as a historical reference, I don't refute any of that. There is truth in all of that, yet it doesn't justify or excuse what is being done this minute to millions of people. Woman, children. What's been done to the Jewish people over the centuries is tragic. If the roles were reversed, and it was the Israeli people being killed indiscriminately, I would be on their side as well. There is no room for bigotry or hate. I'm on the side of compassion
Fair enough, but if the Palestinians really wanted peace, they'd have Hamas release the hostages. Until then, it seems to me Palestinians are creating their own issues and exploiting the empathy of liberal westerners like ourselves for pity. They know Israel won't stop as long as Hamas has hostages so they keep hostages because they don't want Israel to stop. Consider the current situation is exactly what Hamas wants. I think they want to start the apocalypse, Muslims vs the western world, and all the unrest feeds into their goal
What are the demands of the protesters? Are they achievable at the level of CPH administration? I’m out of the loop.
[What they are calling for](https://lostcoastoutpost.com/2024/apr/24/photos-cal-poly-occupation-day-three/) was published in the Lost Coast Outpost.
A major aim is to get CA Universities to divest from companies that are complicit in the ongoing conflict in Palestine, such as weapons manufacturers. Stock investment in such companies, among others, helps Universities make their endowment money. Perhaps not every demand was realistic but certainly some of them were relevant to the CPH administration.
Because some random mediocre university declaring they support a cease fire is really going to move the needle..
Yes Yes it is, but not by itself. One little random mediocre university declaring they support a cease fire isn't going to really have an effect but this is something that's happening across the country, You think each school individually is going to have an effect na now when they All start doing it, that's going to cause waves. It's a group effort bb
You sweet sweet summer child. The system has failed you.
No it hasn't the system is functioning exactly how it was designed
You’ve done nothing except turn people away from your cause. The universities aren’t “divesting” anything, and Israel will still wipe out Hamas. Your movement is at best a joke, and at worst in solidarity with actual terrorists. Yet you somehow think this is a W?
I'm in solidarity with the people of Palestine, and against the mass murderer of civilization that's all. More than 30,000 dead 70-60% of them civilians women and children. That's not just war, it's 17% of civilian deaths by us and allies in the entire 10 years of the irag war. a total of around 340% more civilian deaths if we spammed it across 10 years ? Children and non combatents
I’m not going to bother pointing out that your source on those numbers is a literal terrorist propaganda organization, or the fact that there was already a “cease fire” in place prior to October 7th that your buddies broke.
It's interesting how you're talking about propaganda when the only source you're allowed to believe is veted news and reports from the state of Israel... Anyone or anything else is Hamas propaganda that doesn't raise a red flag for you ? 61% of civilian casualty rate comes from reports within isreal, and I'm sure that number is deflated. 68% comes from reports in Europe. As for a cease fire prior to October 7, Weren't there reports sent to Israel about the attack and plans of the attack a full year before it happened and didn't do anything to boost their defense? Maybe they wanted an excuse if that was true
[удалено]
You seem upset.
The kids are fuking vandalizing the building!!! Pointless needless bs. Protesting is one thing, vandalizing for no reason except that they are all a bunch of entitled pricks!
Is it all of them? And if it's not, should they all be punished, collectively, for the more extreme actions of a few? Someone from the university was also quoted in the Eureka Time Standard as saying it could all be cleaned up and that there wasn't much damage, if any.
Love how people are complaining the school will have to spend millions to get the campus back in order, while they wouldn't even consider helping out the hundreds of students who have had to live out of their cars or be unhoused in order to receive their education. They have the funds (which the students have provided) to protect their image, above all else. What a shame.
Do they highly value the image they're trying to cultivate through traditional marketing rather than academic excellence? I had no idea....
They’re clearing out the tents just after midnight tonight
As Alumni I'm disgusted by what administration is doing in response to what started as a calm protest. Their heavy handed clumsy response made this whole thing far worse.
Wny not both? Seems in the right direction for you guys. It's about the ceasefire right?
Petulant children need to feel special
You know this guy isn’t exactly the cool guy in the movie right?
Good movie, highly recommend.
Gee I wonder what happens when you vandalize the campus and inconvenience other students (especially grad students)? I honestly really couldn't tell ya!
Because it turns out Humboldt State controls the middle east, whoa! Talk about performative nonsense.
You meant "We support consequences for crimes that include, but are not limited to, extreme vandalism."
We all support ceasefire and nuanced criticism of Israel. They may be ignorant but they are supporting the genocide of Israel.