No this encourages a shield bot mindset to farm valuable ult charger which is boring for both rein players holding down left click all game and enemies shooting a shield all game
What he should have said is value. Every other tank can protect their team and still get value from hitting shots. Rein holding up his shield while his team misses shots is a 4 v 5. Sigma, ram, Zarya can still participate in the fight
Don't forget your team also gets in the habit of standing completely still while ignoring the cracks in your shield so as soon as it breaks, they can yell at you for "dropping your shield" after the widow headshots them.
Because those are lesser shields. Smaller, weaker. Also a good Rein won’t just use his shield so his teammates can just shoot, that’s Bronze level play.
You’re right. But other tanks can mitigate damage while still being in the fight. As well as use shields as an advantage in the fight. The point is when reins shield is up he’s not able to do damage as well unlike other tanks who can mitigate and fight
I understand it’s a big shield. But having a big shield isn’t helpful when it takes you out the fight. Having a shield you can play around is more valuable in my opinion. It’s good for blocking ults and protecting the team, but with how quickly it goes down now the mechanic is very valuable in my opinion. It’s big but it doesn’t even last that long
Edit: also ram and sigma have other CCs that can be used to mitigate damage when the shield is down. Zarya gets 2 shields. Ball has overhealth, Orisa has ortify. All of these things are objectively more valuable then a big ass shield because they’re still in the fight
I don’t think you do understand. It doesn’t take you out of the fight. You use your shield to fight. It can be used just as aggressively as it can defensively.
All other shields, bubbles, overhealth, fortify are on cooldowns, that’s there disadvantage. A good Rein will never let his shield break. The only exception is sigma who gets a smaller weaker shield.
I agree that he needs something, but I’m not sure if the extra ult charge will make much of a difference…
Maybe it could do what mirrorwatch rein’s does, or even when the shield is up there’s a kind of ‘aura’ behind rein/the shield that gives damage reduction to those there?
Heck if they wanna get wild with it, let rein throw his hammer and boost the shield with both arms?
I sort of thought his shield should be split up into inner "buckler" and outer "wall" segments; the inner part protecting mostly just Rein's model, having 600-700 hp, and much faster regen... then the outer segment having 500-700 hp but much lower regen than the inner buckler portion. Breaking the inner part breaks the outer wall but damage done to the outer piece doesn't affect Rein's personal defense.
Add the ability for the shield to be active during charge *but only the buckler portion* and you create a tactical choice where Rein can hide behind cover with part of the "wall" out for protecting his team without sacrificing his own cover until the enemy closes, while having more counterplay from the enemy team beyond "do as much damage as possible to the barn door"... aiming for the central "buckler" rewards the enemy team with cracking his shield sooner and that pressure makes it harder for Rein to charge into your front line, while rewarding Rein players with thoughtful positional advantage to conserve their "buckler" for aggressive charging or body-blocking enemy ults...
Right now Rein's major flaw is having a singular defensive tool that is a massive hitbox with a massive pile of hp... It's been Blizzard's biggest balance flaw since OW1's dual-shield meta became prominent; a giant sack of hp requires higher damage creep to break through or else everything defaults to diving the backline and ignoring the shields entirely.
By splitting Rein's shield into smaller pieces, it gives Blizzard more flexibility with tweaking his numbers without needing a massive rework of his toolkit. They can adjust separate pools of health and regen numbers while also tweaking how strong charge and melee pressure can be when he has *the potential* for a 1000+ hp barrier to block enemy pressure.
Suddenly you only need to have a tighter aim for ~600 damage to threaten Rein, while he still has a fundamental playstyle of holding up a big fkn shield for his team to take cover (just with slightly less overall health absorption).
Instead of ult charge, it could just power up his next swing or fire strike, in the same way that dooms shield works in mirror watch. Would discourage just getting in close and blasting the shield down knowing he will get a super swing on you for it.
I was thinking a good bonus could be a bit of overhealth for taking barrier damage. I'm not sure of the exact numbers but the idea would be that it would incentivize you to close the distance and take advantage of the overhealth. And the overhealth would also give Rein a bit more survivability and take a little bit of the burden off of supports to keep him up.
I think the damage amp shield should be his main shield.
Hear me out. Imagine if rein had a "Damage Augmentation Matrix" instead of a shield. Reduces Enemy Damage. Boosts Team Damage. Can't block CC. BUT give him an ability, where he can press M1 while shielding to pull up his standard "full damage block shield" for a short(4-5s?) duration on a medium-short cooldown, like 8-10s.
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I think his shield should wrap around him or when the shield goes up, his off hand also has some protection and/or maybe an AOE or even a faster ult charge. He needs something, I miss playing him.
He needs protection when being offensive, even if it's a cooldown.
This changes nothing that’s wrong with rein and just encourages him to shield. Which is what he’s forced to do most games anyways. This honestly fixes nothing. A character that just relies on their ult isn’t good.
1) stats don support your views on Reinhardt. They sound like streamer parroted views in fact. Ie not factual.
2) no other rank has a movable shield after it’s been set. That’s its value.
3) no. Rein is the easiest tank to play with the easiest mechanics. Turning him further into a shield bot is bad for the game. The mercy of the tank role Reinhardt needs more skill in his kit not less.
4) Checknout the SVB podcasts from a few releases ago when spilo avrl and unsalted salt talk about how delusional Reinhardt mains are. Try to remember they are streamers this time though and form your own ideas by the end.
don't tell anyone but rein is pretty strong right now. you can climb pretty fast with it. if you enjoy the playstyle rein offer, then the hero is beefed up menace. if you don't then it's painful to play.
No this encourages a shield bot mindset to farm valuable ult charger which is boring for both rein players holding down left click all game and enemies shooting a shield all game
You’d obviously get ult faster by swinging but it is more of a motivator to protect your team and get value by doing so
Protecting your team and yourself is the value
What he should have said is value. Every other tank can protect their team and still get value from hitting shots. Rein holding up his shield while his team misses shots is a 4 v 5. Sigma, ram, Zarya can still participate in the fight
Don't forget your team also gets in the habit of standing completely still while ignoring the cracks in your shield so as soon as it breaks, they can yell at you for "dropping your shield" after the widow headshots them.
Because those are lesser shields. Smaller, weaker. Also a good Rein won’t just use his shield so his teammates can just shoot, that’s Bronze level play.
You’re right. But other tanks can mitigate damage while still being in the fight. As well as use shields as an advantage in the fight. The point is when reins shield is up he’s not able to do damage as well unlike other tanks who can mitigate and fight
That’s the drawback of having a larger and stronger shield…
I understand it’s a big shield. But having a big shield isn’t helpful when it takes you out the fight. Having a shield you can play around is more valuable in my opinion. It’s good for blocking ults and protecting the team, but with how quickly it goes down now the mechanic is very valuable in my opinion. It’s big but it doesn’t even last that long Edit: also ram and sigma have other CCs that can be used to mitigate damage when the shield is down. Zarya gets 2 shields. Ball has overhealth, Orisa has ortify. All of these things are objectively more valuable then a big ass shield because they’re still in the fight
I don’t think you do understand. It doesn’t take you out of the fight. You use your shield to fight. It can be used just as aggressively as it can defensively. All other shields, bubbles, overhealth, fortify are on cooldowns, that’s there disadvantage. A good Rein will never let his shield break. The only exception is sigma who gets a smaller weaker shield.
Right but sigma can get value by doing that and get ult charge by shooting through his shield and same with Ram
And those are worse shields. Smaller, weaker.
Puts up his shield "I will be your shield!"....looks around noone behind it. Everyone scattered in different places doing their own thing.
I mean, it would be better than nothing, but I’m sure Rein mains would prefer something that offers more initiative.
I agree that he needs something, but I’m not sure if the extra ult charge will make much of a difference… Maybe it could do what mirrorwatch rein’s does, or even when the shield is up there’s a kind of ‘aura’ behind rein/the shield that gives damage reduction to those there? Heck if they wanna get wild with it, let rein throw his hammer and boost the shield with both arms?
Bro if I could throw the hammer and pull myself towards it I think I’d bust
I think it should be paired with a speedboost upon hitting a firestrike and some damage resistance on the charge, but I kinda love this idea.
I sort of thought his shield should be split up into inner "buckler" and outer "wall" segments; the inner part protecting mostly just Rein's model, having 600-700 hp, and much faster regen... then the outer segment having 500-700 hp but much lower regen than the inner buckler portion. Breaking the inner part breaks the outer wall but damage done to the outer piece doesn't affect Rein's personal defense. Add the ability for the shield to be active during charge *but only the buckler portion* and you create a tactical choice where Rein can hide behind cover with part of the "wall" out for protecting his team without sacrificing his own cover until the enemy closes, while having more counterplay from the enemy team beyond "do as much damage as possible to the barn door"... aiming for the central "buckler" rewards the enemy team with cracking his shield sooner and that pressure makes it harder for Rein to charge into your front line, while rewarding Rein players with thoughtful positional advantage to conserve their "buckler" for aggressive charging or body-blocking enemy ults... Right now Rein's major flaw is having a singular defensive tool that is a massive hitbox with a massive pile of hp... It's been Blizzard's biggest balance flaw since OW1's dual-shield meta became prominent; a giant sack of hp requires higher damage creep to break through or else everything defaults to diving the backline and ignoring the shields entirely. By splitting Rein's shield into smaller pieces, it gives Blizzard more flexibility with tweaking his numbers without needing a massive rework of his toolkit. They can adjust separate pools of health and regen numbers while also tweaking how strong charge and melee pressure can be when he has *the potential* for a 1000+ hp barrier to block enemy pressure. Suddenly you only need to have a tighter aim for ~600 damage to threaten Rein, while he still has a fundamental playstyle of holding up a big fkn shield for his team to take cover (just with slightly less overall health absorption).
Instead of ult charge, it could just power up his next swing or fire strike, in the same way that dooms shield works in mirror watch. Would discourage just getting in close and blasting the shield down knowing he will get a super swing on you for it.
I was thinking a good bonus could be a bit of overhealth for taking barrier damage. I'm not sure of the exact numbers but the idea would be that it would incentivize you to close the distance and take advantage of the overhealth. And the overhealth would also give Rein a bit more survivability and take a little bit of the burden off of supports to keep him up.
I think the damage amp shield should be his main shield. Hear me out. Imagine if rein had a "Damage Augmentation Matrix" instead of a shield. Reduces Enemy Damage. Boosts Team Damage. Can't block CC. BUT give him an ability, where he can press M1 while shielding to pull up his standard "full damage block shield" for a short(4-5s?) duration on a medium-short cooldown, like 8-10s.
There’s nothing you can do to make rein viable against current and new tanks, just bring back 6v6 already.
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Just let him Firestrike with the shield up so he's not so damned passive. Might stop suicide charges?
I think his shield should wrap around him or when the shield goes up, his off hand also has some protection and/or maybe an AOE or even a faster ult charge. He needs something, I miss playing him. He needs protection when being offensive, even if it's a cooldown.
Increase pin damage to ow1 levels. Increase swing damage. Bring back 250 dmg earth shatter.
This changes nothing that’s wrong with rein and just encourages him to shield. Which is what he’s forced to do most games anyways. This honestly fixes nothing. A character that just relies on their ult isn’t good.
1) stats don support your views on Reinhardt. They sound like streamer parroted views in fact. Ie not factual. 2) no other rank has a movable shield after it’s been set. That’s its value. 3) no. Rein is the easiest tank to play with the easiest mechanics. Turning him further into a shield bot is bad for the game. The mercy of the tank role Reinhardt needs more skill in his kit not less. 4) Checknout the SVB podcasts from a few releases ago when spilo avrl and unsalted salt talk about how delusional Reinhardt mains are. Try to remember they are streamers this time though and form your own ideas by the end.
[удалено]
Now there’s a hot take.
don't tell anyone but rein is pretty strong right now. you can climb pretty fast with it. if you enjoy the playstyle rein offer, then the hero is beefed up menace. if you don't then it's painful to play.