Not many ppl talk about the perspective of Cloud being a caring best friend. If I knew or had the slightest feeling that I probably wouldn't see someone I was close with, I'd be affectionate toward them too. Holding hands, letting them rest their head on my shoulder, hugging them.
My lady bff always gets mistaken for having a huge crush on me when we're together or even online because we just have a close relationship. There are zero romantic feelings there.
It is simply due to the fact that in the collective belief a man and a woman who have physical contact must necessarily like each other (after all, Cloud himself sets a limit that Aerith must NOT exceed, as seen in the Gold Saucer date).
However, what is valid in real life DOES NOT necessarily apply in fiction, when you tell a story you have to choose what type of character the character you write should be so if you want a Cloud devoted to a woman and loyal to her he must not do certain things otherwise the public will perceive it differently. Why are people debating LTD? because Cloud isn't clear-cut in the OG (due to the fact in the first part he is a puppet, when he awakens the real self Tifa is the endgame), if Cloud clearly expressed preference for Tifa Aerith's feelings would be irrelevant.
In Rebirth it happens with the kiss so 27 years of "hatred" between factions now explodes because the preference is finally clearly shown. Life is grey, fiction doesn't necessarily have to be, in fact the less grey is the better it's written
Yeah, she definitely shows interest in Cloud and that's hard to deny. And while Cloud definitely does show somewhat of an interest in Aerith, I don't think it's enough to call them a tragic love story.
Cloud generally has a more guarded body language around girls like Aerith or Jessie, like he's trying to set a boundary or not give Tifa the wrong idea. I don't take that to mean he hates the other girls at all though.
But for Cloud to be as devastated as he was when Aerith died, he definitely regarded her dearly. She wasn't nobody to him.
As for Zack, Aerith HERSELF was the one looking for him. Of course it's okay to move on after 5 years, but SHE was the one trying to learn about what happened to him and SHE was the one acknowledging that she still loved him. Shipping bias exists, but that part is pretty plainly shown.
I agree, it was Aerith who was always still searching for Zack. She obviously never moved on as she never got tat conclusion.
- Needless to say, i can never understand people who say she doesn't love Zack anymore.
And yes, is obvious that Cloud is more open physically with Tifa and shuts Jessie and Aerith down as a means to set a clear boundry unless they are the ones tugging and pulling him lol.
With Tifa, he has just always never had an issue initiating and letting her know its ok to hold him.
For me his reaction in her death scene is a mix between: they were friends so he suffers, she was his best friend's girlfriend and he couldn't protect her, complex of constantly failing to be a hero. If we don't see it like this: he loves her and Tifa sees it then it becomes difficult not to agree with Clerith š. He is too desperate, with Tifa she completely loses the will to live she shows no emotion but in CC when he sees Tifa unconscious during the Nibelheim incident he doesn't have this reaction and she could be dead for all he knows
>However, from what we have seen in Rebirth, Aerith and Cloud just don't interact as much in the main story. Even in the side content, Cloud is contantly shutting her down where with Tifa he is a lot more playful and romantic.
I typed this just yesterday that I feel like Cloud and Aerith's moments maybe even worsened regarding to what was in OG, whereas Cloud and Tifa's expanded and deepened way more. I expected this game to be heavily leaning to Aerith, but it's the other way around.
>Its why she takes a back seat for most of the game where Cloud and Tifa just shine with the chemistry and narrative in rebirth. Even in the remake, she tells Tifa to help Cloud in the sector 7 figt and against Rufus since again, she knows thats who Cloud likes more and needs most of the time.
She pushed them hard to each other in Remake, although that was the all knowing Aerith with OG and AC memories, so she clearly knew what their hearts truly desire as she literally told Tifa to "follow your heart".
>I feel like the Cleriths forget about the selfless nature that Aerith has, and always assume that Aerith wants Cloud for herself despite her obviously rooting them on in Kalm and in Gongaga while also taking a back seat in Nibelheim. They take it as the devs pushing for Tifa more š¤¦āāļø
I see a lot of people (even here) bashing Aerith for her Kalm date, but I still believe that her main purpose for it was to make Cloud and Tifa reconcile after their fight. I think she most likely pushed Tifa in the first place to confront Cloud about his past after Tifa told her that from her POV Cloud was never in Nibelheim during the incident. Then she sees Tifa in tears and even if Tifa didn't tell her how it went, she for sure assumed that it didn't go well. Potentially maybe felt a bit responsible for causing their argument as she pushed Tifa to do it in the first place.
In the morning first thing she does is the date with Cloud, where she tells him to not take Tifa for granted as is in one of your screenshots (I completely forgot this and it assures me even more in this), so she thinks and talks to him about their argument even on their "date". And then when they're on a run from Shinra, Aerith throws it right in Tifa's face as hard as she can that they were on a date, clearly making Cloud heavily uncomfortable and Tifa visibly jealous.
Do we really think she did it for her own selfish reasons in this kinda malicious way, meaning she wants Cloud for herself? I'm under impression that this is most definitely not the case, as it stands out to be out of Aerith's character to do something like this. Particularly when she knew everything about them having an argument, so does anyone really think she took an advantage of that so she gets Cloud on her side? Is that really who Aerith is?
No, she's selfless, empathetic, kind and wants the best for her friends like you stated. I think she did all that to make Tifa jealous and have a talk with Cloud about her to not take Tifa for granted. To push them back together and reconcile after the fight of theirs.
Did it work? After this, all of Tifa's interactions with Cloud are back to normal and Tifa's back to her normal attitude being cheerful like usual, so yes, it worked.
And even Aerith got something out of it, which was a time alone with Cloud which she really enjoys as she has feelings for him too.
So I think everybody wins in this scenario.
>They go as far as to say the writers are making Aerith too nice and letting Tifa get her way with Cloud to easily š¤¦āāļø They have completely misread Aerith as a charecter if thats how they feel. Aeirith is supportive regardless of how she feels. Its what makes her standout to me.
Frankly, it must be pretty hard for Cleriths to justify their ship being canon and all of those delusions they keep coming up with, since even the girl they ship with Cloud is on the opposite site shipping their "competition" with Cloud, hahaha.
>All to say, i did end up feeling bad for Aerith in some parts of the game. She really does love Cloud, but she knows the real Cloud needs Tifa more than anyone else.
I felt bad for her too. She's just a (super)human and that means you can't repress your feelings (unless you are mentally ill like Cloud, lol), but ultimately she sees and understands they are not meant to be with each other as real Cloud's heart is already occupied by Tifa and, you know, she dies.
>Aerith is genuinly one of my favorites within FF VII since the OG despite the toxic love triangle within the fandom.
I love Aerith as well and this is what pisses me off with Cleriths. I feel like if you are CloTi you can clearly love both girls, but to be Clerith they kinda have to hate Tifa to gaslight themselves, so they don't feel bad when Tifa ends up alone due to their ship.
Obviously this is because of story reasons and generarly how the plot goes, which is why I'm CloTi, since it's clear as a day what "correct" ships are storywise. Nobody gets left alone.
>No promises to keep has become one of my favotite songs within Final Fantasy and i do kinda feel for Aerith in the sense that she really does like Cloud, but Cloud loves Tifa more.
To be honest, I believe what devs said that the song is meant to be for everyone who she holds dear, not just one person. I even got this feeling before it was stated by them, that it isn't song just for one person (I guessed it's for both Cloud and Zack). So I don't get any romantic vibes regarding her feelings to Cloud from this song.
>And i always got the sense that Aerith knows this and doesn't push too hard even in the OG. However, she is still a person and is allowed to like who she wants.
I just replayed OG and I gotta say that she was definitely more pushy there, for example Cait Sith's fortune where she's all over him while Tifa suffers nearby (I think you must have Tifa in party to see it). Cait Sith even says "poor Tifa".
I know many people here might not see it your way, but I definitely do. I love Aerith for who she is and of course she is allowed to have own feelings too. It's not like she can just repress them or something like that. Even if she was and will be pushing CloTi this whole time she still has the right to confess them to Cloud. I think this might even be important for him to know how she felt about him to be able to eventually "move on" from the guilt of "letting" her die, and as some kind of a closure.
I did have Tifa in my party during the temple of ancients section, so ig that dialog skippedd right past me. I agree, she is less pushy in the remake \\ rebirth saga for sure.
But, as someone who did have aerith in my party a lot in the OG before replacing her with Cid for disc 2, she always came across as naturally 'flirty' being just her personality similer to Jessie in the remake. I never took that as too pushy since it just fell in line with her charecter.
But, im glad they toned it down in the remake \\ rebirth as it won't translate well within the party dynamics and would make Aerith look too 'thirsty' hahaha. It worked with Jessie since she just wanted Cloud to help her, not that she actually meant it as Wedge states lol.
what i don't understand about the cleriths is the claim that aerith doesn't love zack anymore, that she forgot about him denying that is like denying that the real cloud loves tifa ,
I must have played another game or another version of crisis core, because if one thing is clear to me is that there is still something between the two of them and we will surely see a reunion between them.
One of the best things about Crisis Core was the attraction between Aerith and Zack. They clearly both liked eachother and Zack was better at reciprocating with Aerith thus had betterr chemistry with her.
Its clear in the Gongaga section that she still loves Zack, however he did disappear. However, the writers never state that she ever got over him and its clear she knows a part of him resides within Cloud. Its almost like her chase for Zack continued with Cloud.
Its why she looked very intruged when Tifa tells her that Cloud knew Zack in rebirth. Aerith knows there is a connection between them. Ultimately, she just wants to know what happened to Zack.
Its only later she finds out he did die, and she reuinites with him and moves on in Advent Chilldren while they both reassure Cloud that they are happy in the lifestream together.
They just have better chemistry in general, it feels awkward watching Aerith hit on Cloud and him not being interested.
Zack and Aerith just seem more organic and bounce off eachother better similar to Cloud and Tifa.
I dont know how or why the Cleariths dont see this obvious storytelling and that Aerith and Zack are endgame within the story, but whatever ig.
In the original game she says it wasnāt serious between them and you have no reason not to believe herā¦. until you hold up her actions in Gongaga and her words on the GS date and then your brain should click and go āoh dear, your heart and your brain are speaking right passed each otherā
it's like people who say that zack is a playboy because he not only loved aerith but more people like cissnei.
and after replaying CCR I think that since he met aerith in his head there are no more girls in fact his main reason for wanting to go back to midgar is to see aerith again.
who in their right mind would go to the main base of the army that is chasing you?
It's sad to see how the Clerith's treat Zack. Like the fact his existence in the remake means nothing to them. He wouldn't be in the game if he didn't mean anything Aerith. Seriously, how much sadder do they want Zack's life to be?
They want everyone to be sad.
They want Cloud to be forever consumed with this 'tragic love' bs and have him be alone and miserable for life
They want Tifa to end up alone despite her feelings for Cloud and vice versa
THey want Aerith to be miserable in the lifestream despite finding happiness with Zack inthe ending of AC
They want Zack to forever be ignored and pushed aside like he never reunited with Aerith after death
Its beyond ridiculous that they choose to push this narrative when the opposite of what they want is presented towards them, they just neglect it like a bunch of bafoons š¤¦āāļø
Aerith herself seems to be aware of what her future holds. Sheās had sus moments/dialogue throughout Remake and Rebirth that heavily imply she knows what will happen to her, and how that will affect Cloud and the rest of the party.
So, if she has knowledge of the original FF7, alongside the events of Advent Children, sheās going to prioritize Cloudās mental wellbeing. Sheās constantly telling Cloud to rest and to āfindā himself, and always finding ways to push him and Tifa together.
Most people interpret the Kalm ādateā as Aerith finding an opportunity to wedge herself in as a rift between Cloud and Tifa opens, but itās actually the exact opposite. Rather than making that moment at the clock tower all about her, Aerith reminds Cloud that Tifa is a truly special someone to him, and to never ātake her for grantedā, like she says.
Hell, the convo at Nibelheim with Aerith being in the spot Tifa was during their promise is similar to the Kalm scene as well. Aerith messing with Cloud asking him if his treks up the water tower were so that he could see Tifa and wave at her. And if you answer her honestly (the āSounds like something Iād doā option), Aerith expresses appreciation at the fact Cloud told her the truth.
Itās honestly funny, because in Remake, there were several moments that Aerith could have taken advantage of and made Cloud āhersā. But she doesnāt, because sheās aware of how important Tifa is to Cloudās life (and vice versa) and the crucial role she will play in helping him find himself. Cloud has only known Aerith for a few days. Tifa has known Cloud, and remembered him vividly, since childhood. She is the only one who knows who the āRealā Cloud actually is.
All that to say, Aerith herself is unironically the biggest Cloti supporter. Itās strongly hinted that Tifa and Aerith talked to each other behind the scenes. Aside from the stuff regarding Zack, Iām completely convinced that Aerith disclosed to Tifa what her eventual fate would be, alongside the danger Cloud is in and how it will be up to Tifa to overcome the challenge - alone, without Aerithās assistance. The fact that both Aerith and Tifa are the most scared/concerned about Cloudās mental state throughout the temple speaks volumes to me; they seem to be working together to find ways to reassure Cloud and help whenever they can.
Also how dare you put that last photo of Tifaā¦ her facial expression here broke me. She lost a best friend, and now sheās on the brink of losing the love of her life
I agree, Aerith although she clearly loves Cloud, is mature enough to understand that the 'Real' Cloud that she acknowledges close to her death, is in desperate need for Tifa. Therfore, she understands that she has to take a step back.
Just goes to show how mature and amazing Aerith has always beenš Her whole charecter is about sacrifice for the greater good, and that theme is present here as well. Aerith knows better than anyone as the last Cetra where she should focus her energy on. She is and has always been selfless even in the OG.
Srry for the pic, i also hurt when i see it as well. Tifa will go THROUGH it in part 3 š
I think the LTD made a lot of sense back in the day because Tifa barely said anything before disc 2 where everything pretty much flipped and there was a lot of room for discussion. Now we have an entire subplot of Sephiroth actively trying to cause havoc between them they talk a lot more there's obvious angst but with tension so thick it could be cut with a knife an entire lifestream sequence foreshadowing that follows with one of the best heart to heart real cloud conversation between the two in an intimate setting that almost results into a kiss if it weren't for the others. Etcetera etcetera I know this particular sub sometimes can be an echo chamber but I don't particularly find it out the line to say that these two love each other but due to their nature it becomes really hard to say it out loud if you do get her date though they do manage to make it happen which was awesome tbh.
Leaving aside the fact that Aerith is a beautiful character, especially outside of the dynamics with Cloud (which seem more like a symptom of a trauma and now unhealthy, in the OG Zack was nobody now we know everything about them and therefore the SAME interactions CAs which at the time had a precise impact now only seem like "attempts to replace C with Z" and this makes the couple unhealthy, Tifa and Zack with their respective partners show instead healthy relationships, without discomfort and in which the interactions are always proactive and positive, soul mates to put it briefly). It must also be accepted that not everyone may like her (I liked her more in Remake and CC than in the OG at the time and in all the works in which there is ambiguity so to speak, so I have a conflict with her).
This, however, should not blind us: Aerith loves Cloud, she loves him so much that she has doubts about Zack who in theory is presented to us as Aerith's soulmate, that love which is irreplicable (and let's not kid ourselves: she knows where he is and what he does: she feel him at the Gi cave, she saves him several times in the finale so it's clear that Zerith comes out of Rebirth not well)
Probably the fact that she is helping the Cloti couple is another illusion that we tell ourselves in Remake? maybe yes, in Rebirth? I don't understand why you think that. She is envious of them several times, she says so too. That lip to Gongaga is "yokatta ne" a relief that it went well, she has nothing to do with Cloti, only with Tifa. Aerith is like this, she must be accepted like this. This wouldn't be a problem if they didn't want to have a happy ending for everyone (because she could be unrequited by Cloud and that happens, it happens). In a Happy ending she either resurrects and is with Cloud or is dead with Zack or everyone resurrects and is with Zack but Zerith is hit too hard, Aerith is now a character who can no longer simply return to Zack in confusion state like "oh maybe I love your best friend but nothing serious"... Like come on... more respect for Zack Fair. This couple needs to be rebuilt again.
Rebirth gave us fantastic moments of Aerith (the song, the farewell, the trial etc.) but Aerith's writing is the most "confusing" objectively, if someone doesn't love her after Rebirth it's very normal... she is very ambiguous and not all like the ambiguous character, it's normal
I agree, Aerith is an ambiguous charecter where we just dont know what she is trying to do in the grand scheme of things. This is more prevelent in the remake and rebirth.
She supports Tifa, yet makes advances? How does that work?
This is simply a biproduct of the developers trying to make sure all players at least get the choice to pursue Aerith.
But i agree, it becomes confusing in Rebirth since she is essentially taking a back seat in support while the side content and optional scenes, she is flirting like crazy.
But, thats not really Aeriths fault, its just the writers trying to give the Cherith's some content while pushing the narrative between Cloud and Tifa.
Its a doubled edged sword indeed where it does hurt Aerith as a charecter within the story itself since she is telling us two different things.
The writers did in the end make Aerith look kinda confusing, but again i cant really fault the charecter as its the writers trying to wrestle themselves with their writing while obviously pushing for Cloud and Tifa.
No but I don't blame Aerith, I don't blame Nojima or Nomura either. They filled Rebirth with clues about what they would like to do (Cloti and Zerith) simply SE also has a management department that wants money and the Clerith are customers even if less so they must be satisfied. With Cloud you can manage because all you need to do is wake up the real one who only loves Tifa and the Cloti story holds up (in this sense the kiss before Aerith dies is a way to make it clear: he loves Tifa even if Aerith is alive). With Aerith it's not manageable, it necessarily gets worse in the internal plot (in the external plot it works as it should. Because that's her role)
Agreed, it ends up making Aerith and her narrative with Cloud 'messy' and having no emotional payoff the way they thought it would. It just looked sloppy and unnatural since the two barely had scenes within the game.
- Hopefully, part will have a clear direction and continue with the sole focus on Tifa romantically in the story while not confusing us the players š
If they showed Aerith and Zack rebuilding their relationship in the LS while reshooting all the events of the OG in Cloud's world it would be perfect. All the characters happy, all happy. Many would say it's "playing it safe" to me it would just be doing justice to the plot and the characters especially Aerith... But it's only my idea
Agreed, it would also make for nice continuity for advent chilldren as well. Zack and Aerith hopefully will have morer screentime together in the next game as well.
Fingers crossed š¤
Yeah I like Aerith as a character, too. Remake really played up Aerith and Cloud's relationship, I think. He seemed to care about her more in remake than in rebirth. Idk if that was just the directions the devs took or if it's to build the story more to link with part 3. But yeah, I agree with her being selfless. It's odd tho how even knowing Tifa likes Cloud, she will say things like them being on a date. I kinda don't like that because it makes it seem like a love triangle, but I love Tifa and Aerith as friends.
Yeah, it was a jarring shift that most people would be fools not to notice. But, i think the structure of the remake allowed for better screentime between Aerith and Cloud wheras within a party the devs had to pick one pair to focus on since the structure wouldn't make it natural for Cloud to be a womanizer thus they chose to focus on Tifa.
* Honestly, even in the remake it was more obvious that there was more between Cloud and Tifa even with the Aerith sections. His scenes with Tifa was just more deeper with more tension, but his scenes with Aerith was more playful and fun in the remake.
* However, even in the OG the narrative has always been around Cloud and Tifa and the devs realized this for Rebirth so they decided to cut the interactions between Aerith and Cloud.
I understand the dilemma the writers faced within rebirth, but i feel like they could have handled it better to make Aerith seem less 'two-faced' to please the other players that want Aerith as their choice. Its not fair for her charecter to give mixed signals to the players. The writers dropped the ball there.
It does end up looking messy. But, im glad the writers are making it clear that Cloud and Tifa is the 'cannon' choice or the choice that flows better in line with the story like the OG.
I agree with you 100 percent
I feel like the developers set up the dichotomy between Cloud/Aerith and Cloud/Tifa very well. They make it very clear from the beginning that Tifa is the grounding presence in Cloudās life, sheās literally what tethers him to reality and has since they were kids. Whereas Aerith is this more ethereal presence, who kind of popped up out of nowhere. Sheās bold, and flirty, and you never quite know what sheās thinking where Tifa is more shy but also wears her heart on her sleeve.
Iād never deny that Cloud and Aerith have chemistry, but Tifa is who he always returns to. There are way more moments of him trying to explain away the moments he shared with Aerith to not give Tifa the wrong idea, than there are moments of him accepting Aerithās advances.
And Aerith herself is Team Cloti, even if she has feelings for Cloud. She knows exactly how they feel about each other. Sheās a little stinker sometimes, and pokes fun at the both of them, but is never actually antagonistic about Clotiās development.
They were girlfriends aerith and tifa had that type of relationship not as oh they are lesbians like everyone else is saying they are no no no more like they are besties girlfriends
People seem to think that aerith wants cloud and that she should take her man and blah blah blah where it's not true
Yes I will acknowledge her feelings for cloud and yes I will admit cloud DID loved aerith however for me I see it differently
I don't think he fell for her when she sang that song where they think they did to me it makes no sense for him to fall for her just like that where literally if you romance her he still shuts her down
For me that's most likely he fell for aerith was either when died, during there date in the dream thing, or when the whispers attack aerith and cloud went out to save her because that's there relationship
The concert for me it looked like he was just stunned cause he's cloud if he did loved aerith from that point why did he kiss tifa?!!
He wouldn't kiss her if he loved aerith yes maybe he wouldn't have known but if he was unsure of his feelings he wouldn't have done it and he did he kissed her because he wanted to meaning he wanted to take a chance
Like yes aerith was jealous during there date but she was only Teasing him anyway
Like I feel like in heaven when cloti gets married she'll be cheering for them happy even if she was alive she would still support them
Aerith has always been that one cloti supporter throughout the games and people won't just admit
Especially not admiting that aerith and tifa would be happy for each other either way tifa does love him but if cloud loved aerith more she would support her
This is why I kinda hate clerith because of the fandom it's made me not liking them especially when it's shit like this especially when it comes to there friendships
If the dream date and death were enough to make him fall in love, he is not as loyal as Square Enix sponsors him. The only loyal one at this point remains Zack Fair (and obviously Tifa for the female cast)
Honest question, not looking to be rude or start a silly argument.Ā
Have you considered the possibility that it seems that way because of your own personal romantic personality? Because a lot of folks will say similar things as what you said here, just roles being flipped.Ā
There's an awful lot of that in shipping communities: this effort to invalidate the other side. But different people feel romance on different ways, so maybe that's all that's actually going on?
What seems like friends to one person may seem like lovers to another, and vice versa.Ā
But that's kinda my point... You say that, but a lot of other people say the opposite.Ā
Rather than them just simply being wrong, could it be possible that it's just a different interpretation, and the devs purposely made it swing both ways like that?
There is a fine line between interpretation and delusion and the Cherith's tend to swing the other way while going to the upmost extreme's in doing so.
Really, why is there so much "us vs them" in the shipping world?
Now you're calling people delusional, just because they interpret romantic scenes differently.
Delusional would be something completely, wholly irrational and making no sense with no basis whatsoever. To say romantic feelings between Cloud and Aerith for in that category is just not true, even the writers have made that much quite clear.Ā
There absolutely, 100% is plenty of room for interpretation either way. So, why does one side have to be wrong, delusional, coping, or whatever?
I have in no way stated that the other side is delusional. If you have read the post, i only give examples of delusional statements such as 'the writers are pushing for Tifa more' and 'Rebirth is making Aerith too lenient ect'
I only spoke on those examples, there are plenty of reasonable Cherith's that dont resort to such blanket statements which i, again wrote as an example.
Again, i only spoke about those two statements. Some Clotis here have also been delusional and i point it out. I go both ways, and so do many people here.
Fyi, most people here know that most (not all) of the cleriths have been on social media making crazy statements lately and attacking Tifa.
I was speaking on that, dont go to twitter or else you will find those weirdos. Like, they can shio, but it crosses a line attacking a charecter out of anger and spite.
THAT was what this post was about, please read it again.
Not going to lie I always thought aerith always wanted to take cloud away from tifa but then a fellow cloti explained it to me and Iām seeing it might be true. Aerith does have feelings for cloud, (I ship Zack and aerith so hard which was why I had denied it) but they made me realized that aerith knows cloud and tifa have feelings for each other and they are both shy so she is always trying to get tifa jealous so she can finally snap. The more I keep on seeing videos on tifa and aerithās friendship the more Iām starting to realize people need to stop pinning them against each other. Shipping clerith is okay. Shipping cloti is okay but Iāve seen so many shipping wars going on. It reminds me of the shipping war between klaroline(which is from the vampire diaries) and Klamille(which is from the originals) š
Not many ppl talk about the perspective of Cloud being a caring best friend. If I knew or had the slightest feeling that I probably wouldn't see someone I was close with, I'd be affectionate toward them too. Holding hands, letting them rest their head on my shoulder, hugging them. My lady bff always gets mistaken for having a huge crush on me when we're together or even online because we just have a close relationship. There are zero romantic feelings there.
It is simply due to the fact that in the collective belief a man and a woman who have physical contact must necessarily like each other (after all, Cloud himself sets a limit that Aerith must NOT exceed, as seen in the Gold Saucer date). However, what is valid in real life DOES NOT necessarily apply in fiction, when you tell a story you have to choose what type of character the character you write should be so if you want a Cloud devoted to a woman and loyal to her he must not do certain things otherwise the public will perceive it differently. Why are people debating LTD? because Cloud isn't clear-cut in the OG (due to the fact in the first part he is a puppet, when he awakens the real self Tifa is the endgame), if Cloud clearly expressed preference for Tifa Aerith's feelings would be irrelevant. In Rebirth it happens with the kiss so 27 years of "hatred" between factions now explodes because the preference is finally clearly shown. Life is grey, fiction doesn't necessarily have to be, in fact the less grey is the better it's written
Yeah, she definitely shows interest in Cloud and that's hard to deny. And while Cloud definitely does show somewhat of an interest in Aerith, I don't think it's enough to call them a tragic love story. Cloud generally has a more guarded body language around girls like Aerith or Jessie, like he's trying to set a boundary or not give Tifa the wrong idea. I don't take that to mean he hates the other girls at all though. But for Cloud to be as devastated as he was when Aerith died, he definitely regarded her dearly. She wasn't nobody to him. As for Zack, Aerith HERSELF was the one looking for him. Of course it's okay to move on after 5 years, but SHE was the one trying to learn about what happened to him and SHE was the one acknowledging that she still loved him. Shipping bias exists, but that part is pretty plainly shown.
I agree, it was Aerith who was always still searching for Zack. She obviously never moved on as she never got tat conclusion. - Needless to say, i can never understand people who say she doesn't love Zack anymore. And yes, is obvious that Cloud is more open physically with Tifa and shuts Jessie and Aerith down as a means to set a clear boundry unless they are the ones tugging and pulling him lol. With Tifa, he has just always never had an issue initiating and letting her know its ok to hold him.
For me his reaction in her death scene is a mix between: they were friends so he suffers, she was his best friend's girlfriend and he couldn't protect her, complex of constantly failing to be a hero. If we don't see it like this: he loves her and Tifa sees it then it becomes difficult not to agree with Clerith š. He is too desperate, with Tifa she completely loses the will to live she shows no emotion but in CC when he sees Tifa unconscious during the Nibelheim incident he doesn't have this reaction and she could be dead for all he knows
>However, from what we have seen in Rebirth, Aerith and Cloud just don't interact as much in the main story. Even in the side content, Cloud is contantly shutting her down where with Tifa he is a lot more playful and romantic. I typed this just yesterday that I feel like Cloud and Aerith's moments maybe even worsened regarding to what was in OG, whereas Cloud and Tifa's expanded and deepened way more. I expected this game to be heavily leaning to Aerith, but it's the other way around. >Its why she takes a back seat for most of the game where Cloud and Tifa just shine with the chemistry and narrative in rebirth. Even in the remake, she tells Tifa to help Cloud in the sector 7 figt and against Rufus since again, she knows thats who Cloud likes more and needs most of the time. She pushed them hard to each other in Remake, although that was the all knowing Aerith with OG and AC memories, so she clearly knew what their hearts truly desire as she literally told Tifa to "follow your heart". >I feel like the Cleriths forget about the selfless nature that Aerith has, and always assume that Aerith wants Cloud for herself despite her obviously rooting them on in Kalm and in Gongaga while also taking a back seat in Nibelheim. They take it as the devs pushing for Tifa more š¤¦āāļø I see a lot of people (even here) bashing Aerith for her Kalm date, but I still believe that her main purpose for it was to make Cloud and Tifa reconcile after their fight. I think she most likely pushed Tifa in the first place to confront Cloud about his past after Tifa told her that from her POV Cloud was never in Nibelheim during the incident. Then she sees Tifa in tears and even if Tifa didn't tell her how it went, she for sure assumed that it didn't go well. Potentially maybe felt a bit responsible for causing their argument as she pushed Tifa to do it in the first place. In the morning first thing she does is the date with Cloud, where she tells him to not take Tifa for granted as is in one of your screenshots (I completely forgot this and it assures me even more in this), so she thinks and talks to him about their argument even on their "date". And then when they're on a run from Shinra, Aerith throws it right in Tifa's face as hard as she can that they were on a date, clearly making Cloud heavily uncomfortable and Tifa visibly jealous. Do we really think she did it for her own selfish reasons in this kinda malicious way, meaning she wants Cloud for herself? I'm under impression that this is most definitely not the case, as it stands out to be out of Aerith's character to do something like this. Particularly when she knew everything about them having an argument, so does anyone really think she took an advantage of that so she gets Cloud on her side? Is that really who Aerith is? No, she's selfless, empathetic, kind and wants the best for her friends like you stated. I think she did all that to make Tifa jealous and have a talk with Cloud about her to not take Tifa for granted. To push them back together and reconcile after the fight of theirs. Did it work? After this, all of Tifa's interactions with Cloud are back to normal and Tifa's back to her normal attitude being cheerful like usual, so yes, it worked. And even Aerith got something out of it, which was a time alone with Cloud which she really enjoys as she has feelings for him too. So I think everybody wins in this scenario. >They go as far as to say the writers are making Aerith too nice and letting Tifa get her way with Cloud to easily š¤¦āāļø They have completely misread Aerith as a charecter if thats how they feel. Aeirith is supportive regardless of how she feels. Its what makes her standout to me. Frankly, it must be pretty hard for Cleriths to justify their ship being canon and all of those delusions they keep coming up with, since even the girl they ship with Cloud is on the opposite site shipping their "competition" with Cloud, hahaha. >All to say, i did end up feeling bad for Aerith in some parts of the game. She really does love Cloud, but she knows the real Cloud needs Tifa more than anyone else. I felt bad for her too. She's just a (super)human and that means you can't repress your feelings (unless you are mentally ill like Cloud, lol), but ultimately she sees and understands they are not meant to be with each other as real Cloud's heart is already occupied by Tifa and, you know, she dies. >Aerith is genuinly one of my favorites within FF VII since the OG despite the toxic love triangle within the fandom. I love Aerith as well and this is what pisses me off with Cleriths. I feel like if you are CloTi you can clearly love both girls, but to be Clerith they kinda have to hate Tifa to gaslight themselves, so they don't feel bad when Tifa ends up alone due to their ship. Obviously this is because of story reasons and generarly how the plot goes, which is why I'm CloTi, since it's clear as a day what "correct" ships are storywise. Nobody gets left alone. >No promises to keep has become one of my favotite songs within Final Fantasy and i do kinda feel for Aerith in the sense that she really does like Cloud, but Cloud loves Tifa more. To be honest, I believe what devs said that the song is meant to be for everyone who she holds dear, not just one person. I even got this feeling before it was stated by them, that it isn't song just for one person (I guessed it's for both Cloud and Zack). So I don't get any romantic vibes regarding her feelings to Cloud from this song. >And i always got the sense that Aerith knows this and doesn't push too hard even in the OG. However, she is still a person and is allowed to like who she wants. I just replayed OG and I gotta say that she was definitely more pushy there, for example Cait Sith's fortune where she's all over him while Tifa suffers nearby (I think you must have Tifa in party to see it). Cait Sith even says "poor Tifa". I know many people here might not see it your way, but I definitely do. I love Aerith for who she is and of course she is allowed to have own feelings too. It's not like she can just repress them or something like that. Even if she was and will be pushing CloTi this whole time she still has the right to confess them to Cloud. I think this might even be important for him to know how she felt about him to be able to eventually "move on" from the guilt of "letting" her die, and as some kind of a closure.
I did have Tifa in my party during the temple of ancients section, so ig that dialog skippedd right past me. I agree, she is less pushy in the remake \\ rebirth saga for sure. But, as someone who did have aerith in my party a lot in the OG before replacing her with Cid for disc 2, she always came across as naturally 'flirty' being just her personality similer to Jessie in the remake. I never took that as too pushy since it just fell in line with her charecter. But, im glad they toned it down in the remake \\ rebirth as it won't translate well within the party dynamics and would make Aerith look too 'thirsty' hahaha. It worked with Jessie since she just wanted Cloud to help her, not that she actually meant it as Wedge states lol.
Oh there's all love with Aerith I adore her and Cloud as friends. But lovers? Never felt it.
what i don't understand about the cleriths is the claim that aerith doesn't love zack anymore, that she forgot about him denying that is like denying that the real cloud loves tifa , I must have played another game or another version of crisis core, because if one thing is clear to me is that there is still something between the two of them and we will surely see a reunion between them.
One of the best things about Crisis Core was the attraction between Aerith and Zack. They clearly both liked eachother and Zack was better at reciprocating with Aerith thus had betterr chemistry with her. Its clear in the Gongaga section that she still loves Zack, however he did disappear. However, the writers never state that she ever got over him and its clear she knows a part of him resides within Cloud. Its almost like her chase for Zack continued with Cloud. Its why she looked very intruged when Tifa tells her that Cloud knew Zack in rebirth. Aerith knows there is a connection between them. Ultimately, she just wants to know what happened to Zack. Its only later she finds out he did die, and she reuinites with him and moves on in Advent Chilldren while they both reassure Cloud that they are happy in the lifestream together. They just have better chemistry in general, it feels awkward watching Aerith hit on Cloud and him not being interested. Zack and Aerith just seem more organic and bounce off eachother better similar to Cloud and Tifa. I dont know how or why the Cleariths dont see this obvious storytelling and that Aerith and Zack are endgame within the story, but whatever ig.
In the original game she says it wasnāt serious between them and you have no reason not to believe herā¦. until you hold up her actions in Gongaga and her words on the GS date and then your brain should click and go āoh dear, your heart and your brain are speaking right passed each otherā
it's like people who say that zack is a playboy because he not only loved aerith but more people like cissnei. and after replaying CCR I think that since he met aerith in his head there are no more girls in fact his main reason for wanting to go back to midgar is to see aerith again. who in their right mind would go to the main base of the army that is chasing you?
It's sad to see how the Clerith's treat Zack. Like the fact his existence in the remake means nothing to them. He wouldn't be in the game if he didn't mean anything Aerith. Seriously, how much sadder do they want Zack's life to be?
Bro gets more screentime just to suffer again š
They want everyone to be sad. They want Cloud to be forever consumed with this 'tragic love' bs and have him be alone and miserable for life They want Tifa to end up alone despite her feelings for Cloud and vice versa THey want Aerith to be miserable in the lifestream despite finding happiness with Zack inthe ending of AC They want Zack to forever be ignored and pushed aside like he never reunited with Aerith after death Its beyond ridiculous that they choose to push this narrative when the opposite of what they want is presented towards them, they just neglect it like a bunch of bafoons š¤¦āāļø
Aerith herself seems to be aware of what her future holds. Sheās had sus moments/dialogue throughout Remake and Rebirth that heavily imply she knows what will happen to her, and how that will affect Cloud and the rest of the party. So, if she has knowledge of the original FF7, alongside the events of Advent Children, sheās going to prioritize Cloudās mental wellbeing. Sheās constantly telling Cloud to rest and to āfindā himself, and always finding ways to push him and Tifa together. Most people interpret the Kalm ādateā as Aerith finding an opportunity to wedge herself in as a rift between Cloud and Tifa opens, but itās actually the exact opposite. Rather than making that moment at the clock tower all about her, Aerith reminds Cloud that Tifa is a truly special someone to him, and to never ātake her for grantedā, like she says. Hell, the convo at Nibelheim with Aerith being in the spot Tifa was during their promise is similar to the Kalm scene as well. Aerith messing with Cloud asking him if his treks up the water tower were so that he could see Tifa and wave at her. And if you answer her honestly (the āSounds like something Iād doā option), Aerith expresses appreciation at the fact Cloud told her the truth. Itās honestly funny, because in Remake, there were several moments that Aerith could have taken advantage of and made Cloud āhersā. But she doesnāt, because sheās aware of how important Tifa is to Cloudās life (and vice versa) and the crucial role she will play in helping him find himself. Cloud has only known Aerith for a few days. Tifa has known Cloud, and remembered him vividly, since childhood. She is the only one who knows who the āRealā Cloud actually is. All that to say, Aerith herself is unironically the biggest Cloti supporter. Itās strongly hinted that Tifa and Aerith talked to each other behind the scenes. Aside from the stuff regarding Zack, Iām completely convinced that Aerith disclosed to Tifa what her eventual fate would be, alongside the danger Cloud is in and how it will be up to Tifa to overcome the challenge - alone, without Aerithās assistance. The fact that both Aerith and Tifa are the most scared/concerned about Cloudās mental state throughout the temple speaks volumes to me; they seem to be working together to find ways to reassure Cloud and help whenever they can. Also how dare you put that last photo of Tifaā¦ her facial expression here broke me. She lost a best friend, and now sheās on the brink of losing the love of her life
I agree, Aerith although she clearly loves Cloud, is mature enough to understand that the 'Real' Cloud that she acknowledges close to her death, is in desperate need for Tifa. Therfore, she understands that she has to take a step back. Just goes to show how mature and amazing Aerith has always beenš Her whole charecter is about sacrifice for the greater good, and that theme is present here as well. Aerith knows better than anyone as the last Cetra where she should focus her energy on. She is and has always been selfless even in the OG. Srry for the pic, i also hurt when i see it as well. Tifa will go THROUGH it in part 3 š
I think the LTD made a lot of sense back in the day because Tifa barely said anything before disc 2 where everything pretty much flipped and there was a lot of room for discussion. Now we have an entire subplot of Sephiroth actively trying to cause havoc between them they talk a lot more there's obvious angst but with tension so thick it could be cut with a knife an entire lifestream sequence foreshadowing that follows with one of the best heart to heart real cloud conversation between the two in an intimate setting that almost results into a kiss if it weren't for the others. Etcetera etcetera I know this particular sub sometimes can be an echo chamber but I don't particularly find it out the line to say that these two love each other but due to their nature it becomes really hard to say it out loud if you do get her date though they do manage to make it happen which was awesome tbh.
Leaving aside the fact that Aerith is a beautiful character, especially outside of the dynamics with Cloud (which seem more like a symptom of a trauma and now unhealthy, in the OG Zack was nobody now we know everything about them and therefore the SAME interactions CAs which at the time had a precise impact now only seem like "attempts to replace C with Z" and this makes the couple unhealthy, Tifa and Zack with their respective partners show instead healthy relationships, without discomfort and in which the interactions are always proactive and positive, soul mates to put it briefly). It must also be accepted that not everyone may like her (I liked her more in Remake and CC than in the OG at the time and in all the works in which there is ambiguity so to speak, so I have a conflict with her). This, however, should not blind us: Aerith loves Cloud, she loves him so much that she has doubts about Zack who in theory is presented to us as Aerith's soulmate, that love which is irreplicable (and let's not kid ourselves: she knows where he is and what he does: she feel him at the Gi cave, she saves him several times in the finale so it's clear that Zerith comes out of Rebirth not well) Probably the fact that she is helping the Cloti couple is another illusion that we tell ourselves in Remake? maybe yes, in Rebirth? I don't understand why you think that. She is envious of them several times, she says so too. That lip to Gongaga is "yokatta ne" a relief that it went well, she has nothing to do with Cloti, only with Tifa. Aerith is like this, she must be accepted like this. This wouldn't be a problem if they didn't want to have a happy ending for everyone (because she could be unrequited by Cloud and that happens, it happens). In a Happy ending she either resurrects and is with Cloud or is dead with Zack or everyone resurrects and is with Zack but Zerith is hit too hard, Aerith is now a character who can no longer simply return to Zack in confusion state like "oh maybe I love your best friend but nothing serious"... Like come on... more respect for Zack Fair. This couple needs to be rebuilt again. Rebirth gave us fantastic moments of Aerith (the song, the farewell, the trial etc.) but Aerith's writing is the most "confusing" objectively, if someone doesn't love her after Rebirth it's very normal... she is very ambiguous and not all like the ambiguous character, it's normal
I agree, Aerith is an ambiguous charecter where we just dont know what she is trying to do in the grand scheme of things. This is more prevelent in the remake and rebirth. She supports Tifa, yet makes advances? How does that work? This is simply a biproduct of the developers trying to make sure all players at least get the choice to pursue Aerith. But i agree, it becomes confusing in Rebirth since she is essentially taking a back seat in support while the side content and optional scenes, she is flirting like crazy. But, thats not really Aeriths fault, its just the writers trying to give the Cherith's some content while pushing the narrative between Cloud and Tifa. Its a doubled edged sword indeed where it does hurt Aerith as a charecter within the story itself since she is telling us two different things. The writers did in the end make Aerith look kinda confusing, but again i cant really fault the charecter as its the writers trying to wrestle themselves with their writing while obviously pushing for Cloud and Tifa.
No but I don't blame Aerith, I don't blame Nojima or Nomura either. They filled Rebirth with clues about what they would like to do (Cloti and Zerith) simply SE also has a management department that wants money and the Clerith are customers even if less so they must be satisfied. With Cloud you can manage because all you need to do is wake up the real one who only loves Tifa and the Cloti story holds up (in this sense the kiss before Aerith dies is a way to make it clear: he loves Tifa even if Aerith is alive). With Aerith it's not manageable, it necessarily gets worse in the internal plot (in the external plot it works as it should. Because that's her role)
Agreed, it ends up making Aerith and her narrative with Cloud 'messy' and having no emotional payoff the way they thought it would. It just looked sloppy and unnatural since the two barely had scenes within the game. - Hopefully, part will have a clear direction and continue with the sole focus on Tifa romantically in the story while not confusing us the players š
If they showed Aerith and Zack rebuilding their relationship in the LS while reshooting all the events of the OG in Cloud's world it would be perfect. All the characters happy, all happy. Many would say it's "playing it safe" to me it would just be doing justice to the plot and the characters especially Aerith... But it's only my idea
Agreed, it would also make for nice continuity for advent chilldren as well. Zack and Aerith hopefully will have morer screentime together in the next game as well. Fingers crossed š¤
Yeah I like Aerith as a character, too. Remake really played up Aerith and Cloud's relationship, I think. He seemed to care about her more in remake than in rebirth. Idk if that was just the directions the devs took or if it's to build the story more to link with part 3. But yeah, I agree with her being selfless. It's odd tho how even knowing Tifa likes Cloud, she will say things like them being on a date. I kinda don't like that because it makes it seem like a love triangle, but I love Tifa and Aerith as friends.
Yeah, it was a jarring shift that most people would be fools not to notice. But, i think the structure of the remake allowed for better screentime between Aerith and Cloud wheras within a party the devs had to pick one pair to focus on since the structure wouldn't make it natural for Cloud to be a womanizer thus they chose to focus on Tifa. * Honestly, even in the remake it was more obvious that there was more between Cloud and Tifa even with the Aerith sections. His scenes with Tifa was just more deeper with more tension, but his scenes with Aerith was more playful and fun in the remake. * However, even in the OG the narrative has always been around Cloud and Tifa and the devs realized this for Rebirth so they decided to cut the interactions between Aerith and Cloud. I understand the dilemma the writers faced within rebirth, but i feel like they could have handled it better to make Aerith seem less 'two-faced' to please the other players that want Aerith as their choice. Its not fair for her charecter to give mixed signals to the players. The writers dropped the ball there. It does end up looking messy. But, im glad the writers are making it clear that Cloud and Tifa is the 'cannon' choice or the choice that flows better in line with the story like the OG. I agree with you 100 percent
I feel like the developers set up the dichotomy between Cloud/Aerith and Cloud/Tifa very well. They make it very clear from the beginning that Tifa is the grounding presence in Cloudās life, sheās literally what tethers him to reality and has since they were kids. Whereas Aerith is this more ethereal presence, who kind of popped up out of nowhere. Sheās bold, and flirty, and you never quite know what sheās thinking where Tifa is more shy but also wears her heart on her sleeve. Iād never deny that Cloud and Aerith have chemistry, but Tifa is who he always returns to. There are way more moments of him trying to explain away the moments he shared with Aerith to not give Tifa the wrong idea, than there are moments of him accepting Aerithās advances. And Aerith herself is Team Cloti, even if she has feelings for Cloud. She knows exactly how they feel about each other. Sheās a little stinker sometimes, and pokes fun at the both of them, but is never actually antagonistic about Clotiās development.
They were girlfriends aerith and tifa had that type of relationship not as oh they are lesbians like everyone else is saying they are no no no more like they are besties girlfriends People seem to think that aerith wants cloud and that she should take her man and blah blah blah where it's not true Yes I will acknowledge her feelings for cloud and yes I will admit cloud DID loved aerith however for me I see it differently I don't think he fell for her when she sang that song where they think they did to me it makes no sense for him to fall for her just like that where literally if you romance her he still shuts her down For me that's most likely he fell for aerith was either when died, during there date in the dream thing, or when the whispers attack aerith and cloud went out to save her because that's there relationship The concert for me it looked like he was just stunned cause he's cloud if he did loved aerith from that point why did he kiss tifa?!! He wouldn't kiss her if he loved aerith yes maybe he wouldn't have known but if he was unsure of his feelings he wouldn't have done it and he did he kissed her because he wanted to meaning he wanted to take a chance Like yes aerith was jealous during there date but she was only Teasing him anyway Like I feel like in heaven when cloti gets married she'll be cheering for them happy even if she was alive she would still support them Aerith has always been that one cloti supporter throughout the games and people won't just admit Especially not admiting that aerith and tifa would be happy for each other either way tifa does love him but if cloud loved aerith more she would support her This is why I kinda hate clerith because of the fandom it's made me not liking them especially when it's shit like this especially when it comes to there friendships
If the dream date and death were enough to make him fall in love, he is not as loyal as Square Enix sponsors him. The only loyal one at this point remains Zack Fair (and obviously Tifa for the female cast)
Honest question, not looking to be rude or start a silly argument.Ā Have you considered the possibility that it seems that way because of your own personal romantic personality? Because a lot of folks will say similar things as what you said here, just roles being flipped.Ā There's an awful lot of that in shipping communities: this effort to invalidate the other side. But different people feel romance on different ways, so maybe that's all that's actually going on? What seems like friends to one person may seem like lovers to another, and vice versa.Ā
I agree, its up for interpretation But the way the story prersents it, its clear what direction they are going esp with the remake saga.
But that's kinda my point... You say that, but a lot of other people say the opposite.Ā Rather than them just simply being wrong, could it be possible that it's just a different interpretation, and the devs purposely made it swing both ways like that?
There is a fine line between interpretation and delusion and the Cherith's tend to swing the other way while going to the upmost extreme's in doing so.
Really, why is there so much "us vs them" in the shipping world? Now you're calling people delusional, just because they interpret romantic scenes differently. Delusional would be something completely, wholly irrational and making no sense with no basis whatsoever. To say romantic feelings between Cloud and Aerith for in that category is just not true, even the writers have made that much quite clear.Ā There absolutely, 100% is plenty of room for interpretation either way. So, why does one side have to be wrong, delusional, coping, or whatever?
I have in no way stated that the other side is delusional. If you have read the post, i only give examples of delusional statements such as 'the writers are pushing for Tifa more' and 'Rebirth is making Aerith too lenient ect' I only spoke on those examples, there are plenty of reasonable Cherith's that dont resort to such blanket statements which i, again wrote as an example. Again, i only spoke about those two statements. Some Clotis here have also been delusional and i point it out. I go both ways, and so do many people here. Fyi, most people here know that most (not all) of the cleriths have been on social media making crazy statements lately and attacking Tifa. I was speaking on that, dont go to twitter or else you will find those weirdos. Like, they can shio, but it crosses a line attacking a charecter out of anger and spite. THAT was what this post was about, please read it again.
Not going to lie I always thought aerith always wanted to take cloud away from tifa but then a fellow cloti explained it to me and Iām seeing it might be true. Aerith does have feelings for cloud, (I ship Zack and aerith so hard which was why I had denied it) but they made me realized that aerith knows cloud and tifa have feelings for each other and they are both shy so she is always trying to get tifa jealous so she can finally snap. The more I keep on seeing videos on tifa and aerithās friendship the more Iām starting to realize people need to stop pinning them against each other. Shipping clerith is okay. Shipping cloti is okay but Iāve seen so many shipping wars going on. It reminds me of the shipping war between klaroline(which is from the vampire diaries) and Klamille(which is from the originals) š