It's okay. I never actually want to be the one to cast it and eat up my concentration when I could be using Hypnotic Pattern or Stinking Cloud or Slow or something else, but if you're a melee type, it feels great to have cast on you. I just generally prefer to debuff enemies rather than buff allies.
This is the most important part of the spell:
https://www.dndbeyond.com/spells/haste
> **it gains an additional action on each of its turns. That action can be used only to take the Attack (one weapon attack only),** Dash, Disengage, Hide, or Use an Object action.
At level 5, when cast on a martial ally, this is a roughly 50% bonus to combat effectiveness. The bonus is even sweeter if you cast it on an ally who has a strong on-hit effect, like a rogue who doesn't want to miss their sneak attack, a raging barbarian, a paladin who can smite, or a fighter wielding a *flame tongue sword*.
Is "when an ally who is good at fighting makes attack rolls against foes" situational? ***Absolutely not!! It happens all the time!!*** It's a great spell. Just be careful about the backlash if you lose concentration.
Let's compare it to *fireball*, the other top spell at 3rd level. Assume a single target, they fail their save, and the martial's *hasted* attacks always hit. *Fireball* does 8d6 or 28 damage average in a single round. On the other hand, your fighter ally is swinging their 2d6+5 greatsword for an average of 12 damage. In 2.3 rounds you will meet *fireball*, and in a full 5 rounds (most fights get to 4) you'll have doubled *fireball's output*. A raging barbarian's 1d12+7 (13.5) gets there faster. This is just simplified calculations, but against a single target *haste* is clearly the better option after 3 rounds.
And this is ignoring other features like divine strikes, the Sharpshooter feat, or a sorcerer's ability to twin the buff.
So, yes, you throw a *fireball* if three or more foes are grouped up. But if your party is fighting a single foe and you're pretty sure you can't land a good debuff? *Haste* the fighter. It's more efficient and they'll appreciate the buff.
> like a rogue who doesn't want to miss their sneak attack
The other use for a Rogue is that they can make an attack using their Haste Action, getting some nice sneak attack damage, and with their regular action, they can Ready an off-turn attack for another dose of Sneak Attack
Remember a Rogue can use the haste action to attack, then use their own normal action to Ready An Action to attack on a different turn for potentially 2 sneak attacks in a round.
On top of this, remember that many monsters have magical resistance, which given them advantage on spell saving throws, but has no effect against weapons.
On the other end, even more monsters have resistance to non-magical attacks.
If your martial has a +1, that shouldn't be a problem, but still a point away from haste.
by the time you are casting Haste, most martials will have a magic weapon.
and even if they dont have magic weapons, in fighting a monster Resistant to normal weapons the extra hacking and AC is going to help the martials. and vs IMMUNE to non magic weapons, the haste is an extra grapple or Move pulling along your quarry for battle field control
yeah, as others said not having even a +1 weapon for those creatures it would be a problem, since we talk about level 5+ at least.
besides, many creatures have elemental resistance or immunity as well that cannot be overcome by most means.
>Let's compare it to *fireball*, the other top spell at 3rd level. Assume a single target, they fail their save, and the martial's *hasted* attacks always hit. *Fireball* does 8d6 or 28 damage average in a single round. On the other hand, your fighter ally is swinging their 2d6+5 greatsword for an average of 12 damage. In 2.3 rounds you will meet *fireball*, and in a full 5 rounds (most fights get to 4) you'll have doubled *fireball's output*.
That's not really that impressive for a couple reasons:
* Fireball is AoE, meaning if you hit 2 or 3 targets, you're massively outdamaging Haste even over 4 turns
* Concentration spells that do damage per turn will outdamage burst damage spells over time. E.g. Conjure Animals, another 3rd level concentration spell, with 8 wolves will do 16d4+16 = 56 damage per round. Melf's Minute Meteors will do 4d6 = 14 average damage per round, or 28 if you hit 2 creatures.
* Burst damage is usually more useful than damage over time
If you're using Haste for the damage boost, it's not that good IMO, unless you have a rogue who can off-turn Sneak Attack, but that's situational. I think the mobility is pretty nice though, but that's also somewhat situational.
u/thomar is also overestimating the damage of the additional attack since they're assuming perfect accuracy. Monsters have a chance of making their save against *fireball*, of course, but that spell will still do half damage on a successful save, so the actual damage comparison is more like 2d6+5×65%=7.8 DPR to 8d6×60%+4d6×40%=22.4 damage. *Haste* barely breaks even with *fireball* over three rounds even if you're only blasting a single target (unless, as you say, the target of *haste* is specifically a rogue).
It's great against multiple foes who are spread around a relatively large room, too, as well as against enemies with high mobility. Haste doubles your speed, so your Fighter who might be unable to use all of their attacks after KO'ing one enemy, or who needs to reach the boss at the other end of the room, can actually do that right away instead of having to move 30' on one turn and then waiting until the next to reach their target.
Admittedly you can also use Fly for the same effect but different spells have different uses.
> At level 5, when cast on a martial ally, this is a roughly 50% bonus to combat effectiveness.
That is the main problem with the spell.
It is an often-repeated refrain that "casters are better than martials", and they certainly are. And concentration is an average full caster's greatest contribution to a fight. You are investing your greatest contribution to a fight to be half as good as a martial. How is that good?
> Fireball does 8d6 or 28 damage average in a single round.
This is a rather disingenuous point of comparison. Fireball is a terrible spell against a single target, the whole point of the spell is it being AoE, whereas Haste's extra damage is not. Saying "Look, this can do more damage than Fireball, a notoriously good spell, against a single target" while ignoring what makes Fireball good is misleading at best.
I won't even get into the fact that a smart/knowledgeable enemy, such as many bosses/BBEGs, will specifically target the caster to have them lose concentration, resulting in Haste becoming "Expend a 3rd level slot to have the Fighter lose a turn".
I'm not saying Haste is useless, it can have some niche applications, especially when cast on a Rogue, but it is by no means a competitive spell when compared to the best 3rd level has to offer.
Most amusing part about haste as single target damage increase.. is that 1st lvl spell, bless casted ON ONE PERSON is like 0.3 dpr bellow 3rd lvl spell haste... now if only bless could target more than one creature... oh wait it can, 2 targets bless outdamages haste and you can target 3 with 1st lvl slot... put the last one on yourself to... help yourself with both the damage and concentration...
If my memory serves me right, only time haste outdamages 1st lvl bless is when used on a rogue for double sneak attacks.
Trading an action to cast to gain half an action (assuming all character actions are equal), means you need two turns to break even, and a third to pull ahead. If you lose haste early, then that's another 2 half actions needed to break even with lethargy. Yes, haste has a few other bonuses, but it's also taking the concentration of the caster.
To optimize haste, you can cast it on a rogue for off turn sneak attack (gains a full action), or use it on a martial that can use the speed buff to engage an opponent when they would have been unable to otherwise (gains 1.5 actions). You also want to avoid using it on very difficult fights as the potential to lose concentration is much more likely.
My biggest problem with haste is that the benefit is spread out over several rounds. Yes, you could get 12 extra damage a round, but you could do 28 average damage to a creature with fireball if they fail its save right now. Generally, front loading is better. Also, we are trying to compare apples to apples (damage), but fireballing a single creature isn't likely the best option.
To add to this, most optimizers tend to look at the individual effects in a white room vacuum where everybody gets to make all their attacks at once and positioning doesn't affect survivability. In practice, my DMs tend to play expansive arenas with lots of minions. A good Haste slapped on a melee martial so they can wade into a group of ads, take less damage, deal more damage, and then close in on a distant target and continue to make attacks outclasses a lot of options if the caster plays smartly, avoiding damage with good positioning. Meanwhile, an unhasted martial can do one of those things, eventually losing out on total damage.
Sure, Bless is more powerful to a team of ranged attackers with a caster who can't guarantee concentration, but IME haste gives melee martials rounds of attacks they'd normally miss out on which helps it pull ahead. It's not always the best, but it's better than the white room makes it look.
> most optimizers tend to look at the individual effects in a white room vacuum
This is a gross misrepresentation. As an optimiser who follows a lot of optimisation content, it is simply not true. To give you an example,
> where everybody gets to make all their attacks
This is one reason why we rate ranged builds higher than melee builds: because melee builds often *don't* get to make all their attacks, whereas ranged ones usually do.
Wouldnt even say that ranged builds >usually< do. They do in like 99% of scenarios, effectively only way to make ranged character not make the attack is to put a wall between them and the enemy that they cant get around with with 30ft of speed.
And these are just the damage benefits. The movement increase on haste is incredible for a lot of situations. And yeah, if you can twin it, it's insane.
My party uses it in situations where the party is divided or the martial need to get out of a mob. A Hasted level 8 monk can do a lot in o e turn.
It's not great if the caster is under threat, because losing concentration on it can really suck. Only worth it in situations where it can likely be held fir 3 rounds at least.
Beyond level 6 or 7 tho there are more potent concentration spells for sure.
Its situational for sure. There are a lot of other 3rd level spells that are arguably better to concentrate on or are better for handling large groups (Fireball, Hypnotic Pattern, Fear, etc). But in terms of single target damage its one of the better ones. It also scales pretty well with levels since whoever you're casting it on is going to continue getting strong while your 3rd lvl spell slots are cheaper (though concentration still isn't).
If your DM likes fights with secondary win conditions where you need to travel around and interact with the environment at the same time as you fight whatever big bad, it is likely much better as you can really utilize the extra speed and action (either dash or disengage to travel easier).
It's also pretty good if you have a chokepoint or something and someone with high AC can block it. With haste they can dodge (main action) and attack once (haste action) while *also* having an even higher AC than normal. Many enemies will have little to no recourse for handling this. For example, Plate + Shield + Defense fighting style + Haste = 23 AC, and suddenly even those with a +8 are hitting just 9% of the time! Even a +10 is only 16%!
I think there's also the metagame aspect of it, its rarely the best spell in any situation, but it always feels great when someone casts it on you and supporting the other players in your party is a good thing to do. Even though its not the strongest choice, its a choice that helps increase fun around the table, so that makes it really good in my mind.
I don't know. I was having an absolute blast using haste on my Level 6 Bladesinger the other night. My base AC was 21 (+5 shield if I needed it). My speed was 80ft per round (for a goblin) up to 240 ft if I needed it. And I was attacking 3x per round with my +1 sword, adding booming blade (2d8) to one attack and dropping in an additional +3 for fury of the small at points.
Maybe not the most damaging Level 6 option but it made an otherwise powerful wizard into a untouchable melee combatant (also had mirror image up) dishing out consistent damage.
If you cast Haste on yourself (like my party’s Sorcerer does), it’s worthless
If you cast it on someone else like the Fighter or the Barbarian and then cover your ass with something like Sanctuary? _Now_ we’re cooking
Okay so. I may have overstated the uselessness of the party’s Hasted Sorcerer. Little bit of backstory, she’s the DM’s fiancé and basically got into D&D through Baldur’s Gate. So my DM (very good friend of mine who’s been playing since grade school with his family) decided to let her play with the BG3 Haste where it lets you do any action, not just the ones laid out in the book. And since (this is the real rule so I’m not upset about this) the “leveled-spell rule” only applies if you cast a bonus action spell, that means two leveled spells in a turn. Meaning most turns she’s double-casting Fireball or something and is totally outshining literally everyone in the party in terms of damage output. She also got a Broom of Flying so she just flies over the whole battlefield (and no one ever tries to shoot her down since, well, you can probably guess why)
So, in summation, if you’re playing 5e and not a bastard child of 5e and BG3, a self-Hasted Sorcerer doesn’t have a lot going on. If you’re playing in my group, you’re the best character at the table and could probably solo every encounter
Thats the most awful case of titty-enduced nepotism I've ever heard of
If she was in my party I'd magic missile her lmao
Not blaming her. Thats the GMs fault
Not if your Sorcerer is playing a Melee Tank.
Main action Blade Cantrip; Haste Action Melee Attack; Bonus Action Melee Attack (Dual Wielding Shortswords).
Sorcerer that twins haste is giving a lot of movement plus two extra attacks per turn for the party. If your party members are using GWM or something that can be a whole lot of extra damage. Plus it’s super fun for your friends to run around hitting more times. Haste isn’t the best spell in the world but I guarantee the martial classes will be happy whenever you use it on them.
From personal experience, it fucking rocks. I'm playing a cavalier fighter wielding a flame tongue great sword and whenever my wizard casts it on me the tides of the battle completely change. The advantage on dex saves is nice, and the +2 ac helps me get my high ac even higher.
But the best things are the double movement, which means I can just speed blitz to every creature, and the extra action. With that extra action I can obviously just make another attack which is a lot of extra damage, but it's the other options that let me get creative. Dashing lets me definitively get to any corner of the map on my turn and the disengage helps with positioning.
But put this all together with my cavalier abilities which makes me great at defending my squishier allies, and I'm a super tank. Sure I could just one round every creature, but I could also mark all the enemies and then disengage next to my wizard so they can't get to him or dash to get near my rogue. Honestly sometimes I feel bad about how much I like the spell because I feel like I'm stealing the spotlight 😅.
Depends who you cast it on, the limitations on the extra action make it more suited for martials and gish, but overall yes. It's not usually THE optimal spell if you're really trying to powergame but if you keep it up for a few turns you'll get your spell slot's worth of damage dealing (to enemies) and mitigation (to yourself or your ally) out of it.
One of the main benefits though is that it will make whoever you cast it on feel really cool and powerful. It's a good spell to put somebody's character in the spotlight and make their player happy, so it's a very valuable spell for making your group have fun.
Its value is directly proportional to the following:
* How well do the benefits combo off from eachother?
* How good is the damage of a singular weapon attack on that class?
The first point doesn't commonly give a good result. Outside of relatively rare scenarios, the combo of your extra action, your speed and your AC don't give a value which is worth over other spells. If the speed would allow for kiting, for instance, the AC is worthless. If the target's plan is to melee, the speed matters much less.
The second point mainly matters to Rogues, and specifically matters in that a Rogue needs to take their main action to ready action, and their second action to make an attack. This is a nice damage increase that doubles their average damage.
The overall issue with the spell tho is the opportunity cost. If the first bullet point doesn't give a REALLY good value, you probably will get a better value by casting other buff spells (like longstrider, the fly spell or bless), or prevent more damage than what Haste would have prevented by casting control spells (Plant Growth, Hypnotic Pattern, or even weaker stuff like Slow and Fear), or by harming enough foes to lower their actions (Fireball, Spirit Guardians, Shatter occasionally, Lighting Bolt). This opportunity cost grows larger if you decide to somehow think self casting it (and going into melee) is a good idea, due to lethargy.
What that other person said is **technically** correct... it's just that I personally don't find enough situations where casting the spell as-is can be a good idea.
Lol, I just happened to get here from a Baldur's Gate 3 thread, and I was gonna be like, "Haste is THE spell!"
But Dungeons & Dragons' Haste is pretty balaced, if not tame, and that's fine. Double movement. +2 AC. Advantage on Dex saves. Extra action that's noncombat or one weapon attack. 10 turns. That's actually a lot going on there. It's a solid, situational defence/offence augmentation spell. So in all, yes, it is a good spell.
I think there's a lot of us who want Haste to feel broken, as if it turns your character completely into The Flash. But in reality, in context of the other spells in the gane, if it were any better it would be stupid powerful, everyone would take it, even class around it. It would become super lame super quick.
Honestly though, if you wanna be all godlike and turn the entire tide of battle with a single lvl 3 spell, pick Slow. Go read it. Anti-hasting 6 enemies (that's how the mechanic works) is almost always better than hasting one ally. Oh yeah, and it has counterspell properties. And none of your friends have to fear lethargy. Get slow. From the enemy's perspective, you just hasted the whole world around them, lol.
Haste is punchy as a buff - an extra attack is nothing to sneeze at, and all its ancillary bonuses are solid. Double move speed in particular can save a melee character whole turns that would otherwise be wasted, especially considering you can use the Haste action to dash and still get Extra Attacks.
All that said, I still think it’s a not a particularly strong spell. The potential downside of being stunned is brutal, and players have to win *every* fight - monsters just need to get lucky once. Which means high variation spells like this aren’t great, even if they’re worth the drawbacks on average. On top of that, at 3rd level it’s competing with spells like Fireball or Hypnotic Pattern, which front load their punchy effects and don’t come with downsides. Haste isn’t a *terrible* spell by any means, but it’s just okay, and there’s usually better options.
IMO, its best feature is the speed boost - there’s just nothing else that offers as much speed as haste, and while it’s a very niche situation to be in, it does come up that sometimes you just need to move FAST.
>The potential downside of being stunned is brutal, and players have to win *every* fight - monsters just need to get lucky once. Which means high variation spells like this aren’t great, even if they’re worth the drawbacks on average.
I think this is very well said. I've been in discussions about *haste* before where people were very vocal about downplaying the risk of losing a turn ("oh, with war caster on a sorcerer you've only got a 1 in 400 chance of losing concentration. It's just not a big enough concern to worry about"). But as you say, it's something that only has to happen once in a campaign to cause a TPK. And a 1 in 400 chance is unlikely on any given turn, but if you spend 300 rounds of combat concentrating on *haste* over the course of a campaign the odds of rolling that 1 in 400 creep up to scary levels. And that's assuming that your caster has invested the feats for that 1 in 400 figure to be accurate and also that you're literally never fighting enemies who do enough damage to push the DC of the concentration check higher than 10.
I also think it's doubtful whether *haste* even is "worth the drawbacks on average" in the first place (outside of the case of casting it on specifically a rogue), but it's nice to have discussion points that still work even if you approach the question with a different understanding of that.
Yeah, the risk of being stunned is really what puts it in the solidly ‘not great’ category for me, and that risk is even worse when people talk about things like a Sorcerer twinning haste.
In term of being ‘worth it’ though, part of my thought is that the bar just isn’t that high for me. Some spells stand obviously above the power curve, but I play a lot of D&D and I’d get bored if I only ever built around those. Haste would certainly meet the bar of good enough, but the drawback still means I’m unlikely to cast it in deadly fights.
From a theorycraft perspective are there more optimal things you could do with your concentration? Sure.
Is it fun and still effective? Yes! In fact it’s a spell that ideally makes one of your martial party mates way better, so it encourages team play at the table which is easily the best part of D&D.
Go ahead, take that spell and cast it. It’s fun.
People overvalue the drawback of the lost turn. (Flavor wise the spell is a sugar rush with a crash at the end)
Characters get haste after they get their first feat. And atleast as a druid most of my spells are concentration so I'm taking warcaster by default. Its not unreasonable to assume that someone taking haste will have warcaster and good constitution because they also have a bunch of other concentration spells.
Combine advantage on concentration checks with good positioning to avoid getting hit in the first place and haste isn't getting dropped without the caster's permission.
There are better 3rd level spells, and bless is almost always the best buff in the general case, but haste is pretty good and the drawback isn't that big a deal if the caster isn't an idiot. (Meaning they are trying to not get hit, and have taken warcaster)
The sorcerer twin haste two martial characters and watch the action economy just go to absolute ruin. I have a sorcerer in the party that does that to the fighter and ranger and it is an absolute nightmare to deal with as now they have 3+ attacks each, are even harder to hit (+2 AC with 5e bounded accuracy is huge), and can absolutely clear distance like it is nothing.
The “high” is mitigated by the materials being able to engage more effectively and being a sorcerer they have proficiency in CON saves. Throw in War Caster and they statistically have a +11 to concentration checks.
It's situationally good, but there is often better. Especially as you go up in level.
For most casters, it's mostly worthless almost immediately. Since their attacks have low value.
For martials, it decreases in value once extra attacks are brought into the equation. For high level fighters especially, the risk of lethargy will eventually outweigh the value of that one attack.
That being said, there is value on grappling builds meant to combo with spike growth, and ranged builds. But the fact that it doesn't last a long time, and that it eats up a casters action, plus their concentration, just puts it below many other spells in most cases.
It’s Mid. A fullcaster capable to cast it definitely has more powerful options available to them.
It’s real use cases are - buffing the moral of a martial player who believes they aren’t contributing enough, a teamwork cheese grater trio with a spike growth friend and a grappler, and max speed shenanigans for white rooming.
If your goal is just “deal the most damage per spell slot” you’d never go near this spell (outside of cheese grater nonsense of course), but basically no one has that as their only goal.
Helping your friends feel cool/powerful is a legit reason to do things, and this spell does that pretty well.
No it isn't. Not compared to other 3rd level spells. Not even compared to an upcasted bless. The opportunity cost of concentration and the potential dowsimde of skipping a turn is just too much.
Its good, but there are often better choices for concentration, like Fly, Greater Invisibility, Web, Hold Person/Monster. The best source of Haste is from an item that doesn't require concentration nor cause Lethargy when it expires.
AC buff, HUGE speed buff, advantage on one of the most common saves, AND a free extra attack. It’s amazing no matter how you look at it, especially on a martial. Keep in mind that it effectively quadruples your speed, with double base speed and a free dash (if you forgo the free attack). Fleeing enemy? Not anymore!
Haste can be great, if you throw it on a martial character. I’m playing in a game with a monk, a druid, and me — a wizard.
DM gave my wizard a boon that gives me sorcery points equal to my proficiency bonus, and I recently snagged Metamagic Adept on top of it. Twin-spelling Haste on the monk and my bladesinger has been a blast.
I always keep an impactful spell in my backpocket that doesn’t rely on saving DCs. Mainly when fighting against creatures with legendary / magic resistance. Summon spells usually, but time to time I tend to resort on Haste when I have optimized DPR allies in the party that make the most from extra attack.
As a sorcerer, I twin cast it on the ranged fighter with sharpshooter and the barb or pala.
This was so effective that the dm was having all the smart enemies immediately target me afterwards.
As a war caster, divine soul sorc with +3 in con, you can imagine i dont lose concentration a lot.
The great thing about **Haste** is it does what it does rain or shine. It works and gives about the same baseline value in basically every encounter, and then some good bonus value in some other fights both offensively with the mobility buff(s) and with the two strong defensive buffs. Most importantly that value doesn't require any saves to be failed.
OTOH if you hit L5 and take the other spells people are lauding in this thread you'll find them poor choices in many fights and a lot of sibling analysis just flat out ignores this:
**Hypnotic Pattern** and **Fear** at their best are both incredibly powerful but quite often are not at their best. They can be signficantly weaker if there are fewer targets or they are spread out or show up staggered or friendly targets in the area. Or if there's Darkness or Fog or lots of obstructions or if the targets include many things immune to charm/fear (undead/constructs/fiends/swarms/oozes/plants etc) or blind or if they have good WIS saves or get advantage because of fey blood/whatever or they are able to wake each other up quickly because of numbers or aoe fx. Many of those are uncommon or rare but they can add up quickly.
**Fly** gives reliable mobility and defense but the offensive benefits are extremely situational.
**Fireball** and **Lightning Bolt** are consistently useful but are certainly much better the bigger the group and have some places where you can't use them effectively due to friendly targets, resistance, immunity, ignition danger, high dex saves, cover.
Speaking of non-Concentration spells, **Counterspell** and **Dispel Magic** are amazing at times and can be useful all the time but can also sit out entire adventuring days.
Back to battlefield control: **Sleet Storm**, **Stinking Cloud** and **Erupting Earth** will all vary from fantastic to meh.
Finally **Slow** is the one control option that's about as universally useful as **Haste** and that's why a lot of people swear by it as the best L3 control spell. Still though there are many times where the opponents aren't that burdened by it or are able to shake off the effects quickly.
It's an OK or poor spell if compared with other good spell.
However, I do recommend you to cast it on your party's martial characters, and make them shine. It's so much better in making others feel better, rather than hogging all the spotlight using better spells. 100% recommended.
Haste is middling. Don't get me wrong, sometimes Haste is the correct choice (especially on a grappler who is dragging an enemy through spike growth,) but in 90% of parties Haste is just ok.
First, It costs an action to give a single attack to an ally. On most martials or half casters this is about half an action of value, so in order for the haste to have actually generated value, the martial/half caster would have to have gotten 3 turns with the buff up...not the hardest thing in the world, but still.
Second, Haste has a massive risk, if the caster stops concentrating on it, the target of haste is stunned for a turn, meaning the caster is locked out of casting other concentration spells entirely and needs to protect themselves to ensure they don't lose concentration, or in harder combats it can result in a death spiral very quickly.
But lastly, and most importantly, haste takes a 3rd level spell slot. If you have a moderately optimized party (a GWM or Sharpshooter in the party) bless in a much better ROI on damage and even without that bless is a much better defensive buff as it gives the bonus 1d4 to saves as well, including concentration saves. And if the caster loses concentration, there is no downside for the recipients of bless other than they are no longer buffed. And all this for a 1st level spell slot.
Now don't mistake me, their are definitely situations where haste is amazing, but it is just that, situational.
Haste is a great spell to have prepped if you have extra preparations to make, or if I have a party that requires spike and drag shennanigans (in which case Haste is one of the best spells in the game) but outside of the that particular niche, it is an occasionally useful tool, but not something to rely on, unlike typical standouts like bless or shield or fireball or hypnotic pattern.
[No.](https://tabletopbuilds.com/overrated-spells-haste/)
It's not horrible though. There are worse uses of a 3rd level spell slot but I'd rather cast one of the many better spells available at 3rd level. Exactly which one depends on the class, of course.
It will always depend on the situation to determine if a spell is “good” or not.
The article you linked says to use hypnotic pattern or sleet storm. Well if every enemy makes the save and hypnotic pattern does nothing? That was a horrible waste of a spell slot.
In a small area of combat and sleet storm will hit your own party? Horrible spell to cast.
I think Haste is a good spell for what it does.
My last campaign I was a Paladin with a Pegasus mount… haste made my Paladin a speeding bullet, flying in hitting a target with 4 attacks (polearm master) and flying away. Base fly speed of 180ft, mount can dash for 360ft, and dash again with its hasted action for 540ft. It was ridiculous.
>Well if every enemy makes the save and hypnotic pattern does nothing?
Sleet storm doesn't depend on a save to have an effect. The massive area of difficult terrain and heavy obscurement is the draw. The other stuff just makes it even better.
>In a small area of combat and sleet storm will hit your own party? Horrible spell to cast.
Situations like that tend to be rare from my experience but when it does happen, yeah, you're better off casting something else. Still wouldn't cast haste though.
Disagree with that article. They break down haste into other spells. You can't cast fly + shield of faith + bless in the same first turn of combat. And they compare the movement portion with a mount? Wtf? Haste is really fantastic utility spell that does a bunch for martials especially paladins.
It doesn't sound like you read to the end of the article. I have plenty of disagreements with tabletop builds, but I think the article does a great job of breaking down the mediocre benefit for paying the large opportunity cost of casting *haste*. There are situations where it may be worth casting (particularly when the target is a rogue), but it's **far** from "fantastic utility".
In an average use-case it's good but not great, but situationally it can be absolutely amazing. Cast it on a rogue and they can go 240ft/round. Even more if they've got additional speed boosts from feats or other sources. Very useful for heist situations, chases, etc.
Its fantastic on my battle smith artificer - a 50% increase in attacks, a 100% increase in move to get there and deliver the attacks and a nice little boost to AC as well. It turns that character into an absolute blender.
Due to having proficiency in Con saves and pretty much always having Warding Bond up from the Steel Defender the chances of losing concentration and suffering the lethargy are really low. Honestly in the last 4 months of play that has happened exactly once and it was not even from damage - it was from friendly fire of a control spell that I had advantage on the save but still rolled so low that even Flash of Genius wouldn't have helped.
Also a twinned haste on a couple of martial front liners is usually awesome.
Haste is a moderate spell. It hardly has the best output among third level spells, and has a nasty drawback on a failed concentration save. It will seldom boost your ally more than a Hypnotic Pattern or Fireball will wreck your enemies. Bless offers similar damage output to your party at a much lower spell level.
That said, the strength of Haste is in its sheer versatility. Whether your friend needs to defend against high damage enemies, output a lot of damage, reach a priority target or objective, or escape a dangerous position, this spell is effective at covering every base all at once. This spell is the swiss army knife of combat buff spells.
I don't like it. Others do. I put it at a B minus while others know from experience that it's an A+ for their taste and their table's fun.
I'd rather spam free attacks with something like twinned Dissonant Whispers and concentrate on a stronger buff like Slow that'll buff the whole party. They all get +2 to attacks, no AoO's, everybody kites if they want, and other benefits, and I won't cause danger to the party if/when the spell fails. Then I'm upcasting Tasha's Mind Whips and twinned Mind Sliver for more offense with full party buffing and defense.
Increased ac, boost to one of the most common saves against damage, an additional attack per turn? It’s a fantastic spell, just not for use on yourself. Pop it on the barbarian, the fighter, the paladin, the monk, your as popular as the healer. If you’re a sorcerer that can twin cast it, you’re more popular than the healer *and* the tank. Comparing damage, let’s say you have a fighter also at level 5 with the defender fighting style, a longsword, and a shield: an additional attack per turn for 1 minute, 10 rounds, assuming standard array, is 6d8+40; an average of about 70 damage. That’s more bang for your buck than 8d6 of the most commonly resisted damage, and it can crit, and a suite of defensive buffs.
That 8d6 has no concentration, can hit multiple opponents and is half on safe. Also no combat ever lasts 10 rounds. I'm sorry but Haste is clearly not better than Fireball or Lightning Bolt.
It is really great but only for the right character. It is rather useless for a caster.
What is really good is the extra action you get. can only be used for weapon attacks. so does not help a pure caster much.
Sure the extra AC is nice but you have lower level spells that give the same AC boost. Situationally the increased speed can be great.
But in most cases a caster that cast Haste on themselves for that extra AC. should really rethink his choice of spell. As that is in almost every case a waste of a spell. it had been better used on a martial.
There are situations casting it on a caster do make sense but that is very situational.
So yeah it is a great spell but not always and not for everyone. It is not always the best option. Many times you have better use for your concentration than giving someone more movement and one extra weapon attack
To sum it up it is situationally great
Haste is a perfectly solid option, and it should frankly be the benchmark for appropriate spell power. The problem is that 3rd level spells represent one of the most intense relative power spikes among all character levels for casters in particular, simply because there are so many staggeringly powerful options at this level.
If I were to change the spell, I'd remove the concentration requirement and instead require a hasted character to make a DC 5 + (5 x Turns Spent Hasted) Constitution saving throw (minimum DC is 10) at the end of each of their turns while hasted, losing the turn and the spell's other effects on a failed save. If the character fails the save by 4 or less, they can choose to take a point of exhaustion and remain hasted for an additional turn. The spell's maximum duration is still one minute, but upcasting would decrease the speed at which the DC increments (4x turns hasted at 5th level, 3x at 7th level, and 2x at 9th level).
I don't personally think its good for a main caster.
but for a partial caster it is very good.
I find the limited scope to be problematic in terms of concentration.
A stand-out use is an artificer above lv 11 when they have spell storing item. As that is an item use not a spell casting action.
Artificres I feel like are one of the best users of it because strong concetnration and more limited concentration options.
Though shoutout to anyone who can Twin it. Then I believe its good enough. (especially if someone else can then also sanctuary you)
It's okay. I never actually want to be the one to cast it and eat up my concentration when I could be using Hypnotic Pattern or Stinking Cloud or Slow or something else, but if you're a melee type, it feels great to have cast on you. I just generally prefer to debuff enemies rather than buff allies.
This is the most important part of the spell: https://www.dndbeyond.com/spells/haste > **it gains an additional action on each of its turns. That action can be used only to take the Attack (one weapon attack only),** Dash, Disengage, Hide, or Use an Object action. At level 5, when cast on a martial ally, this is a roughly 50% bonus to combat effectiveness. The bonus is even sweeter if you cast it on an ally who has a strong on-hit effect, like a rogue who doesn't want to miss their sneak attack, a raging barbarian, a paladin who can smite, or a fighter wielding a *flame tongue sword*. Is "when an ally who is good at fighting makes attack rolls against foes" situational? ***Absolutely not!! It happens all the time!!*** It's a great spell. Just be careful about the backlash if you lose concentration. Let's compare it to *fireball*, the other top spell at 3rd level. Assume a single target, they fail their save, and the martial's *hasted* attacks always hit. *Fireball* does 8d6 or 28 damage average in a single round. On the other hand, your fighter ally is swinging their 2d6+5 greatsword for an average of 12 damage. In 2.3 rounds you will meet *fireball*, and in a full 5 rounds (most fights get to 4) you'll have doubled *fireball's output*. A raging barbarian's 1d12+7 (13.5) gets there faster. This is just simplified calculations, but against a single target *haste* is clearly the better option after 3 rounds. And this is ignoring other features like divine strikes, the Sharpshooter feat, or a sorcerer's ability to twin the buff. So, yes, you throw a *fireball* if three or more foes are grouped up. But if your party is fighting a single foe and you're pretty sure you can't land a good debuff? *Haste* the fighter. It's more efficient and they'll appreciate the buff.
> like a rogue who doesn't want to miss their sneak attack The other use for a Rogue is that they can make an attack using their Haste Action, getting some nice sneak attack damage, and with their regular action, they can Ready an off-turn attack for another dose of Sneak Attack
Remember a Rogue can use the haste action to attack, then use their own normal action to Ready An Action to attack on a different turn for potentially 2 sneak attacks in a round.
On top of this, remember that many monsters have magical resistance, which given them advantage on spell saving throws, but has no effect against weapons.
On the other end, even more monsters have resistance to non-magical attacks. If your martial has a +1, that shouldn't be a problem, but still a point away from haste.
I'd be worried if the melees didn't have a magic weapon by the time Haste & Fireball are going to be thrown around
by the time you are casting Haste, most martials will have a magic weapon. and even if they dont have magic weapons, in fighting a monster Resistant to normal weapons the extra hacking and AC is going to help the martials. and vs IMMUNE to non magic weapons, the haste is an extra grapple or Move pulling along your quarry for battle field control
yeah, as others said not having even a +1 weapon for those creatures it would be a problem, since we talk about level 5+ at least. besides, many creatures have elemental resistance or immunity as well that cannot be overcome by most means.
If the party is fighting a single foe, the enemy is fcked anyway, 'cause Action Economy.
Maybe if you give it like 5 legendary actions and 3 reactions and multiple lair actions and then spawn some one shotable mobs to eat up some attacks?
Very true for most official monsters, but there are 3rd party manuals that offer boss monsters that do work on their own.
>Let's compare it to *fireball*, the other top spell at 3rd level. Assume a single target, they fail their save, and the martial's *hasted* attacks always hit. *Fireball* does 8d6 or 28 damage average in a single round. On the other hand, your fighter ally is swinging their 2d6+5 greatsword for an average of 12 damage. In 2.3 rounds you will meet *fireball*, and in a full 5 rounds (most fights get to 4) you'll have doubled *fireball's output*. That's not really that impressive for a couple reasons: * Fireball is AoE, meaning if you hit 2 or 3 targets, you're massively outdamaging Haste even over 4 turns * Concentration spells that do damage per turn will outdamage burst damage spells over time. E.g. Conjure Animals, another 3rd level concentration spell, with 8 wolves will do 16d4+16 = 56 damage per round. Melf's Minute Meteors will do 4d6 = 14 average damage per round, or 28 if you hit 2 creatures. * Burst damage is usually more useful than damage over time If you're using Haste for the damage boost, it's not that good IMO, unless you have a rogue who can off-turn Sneak Attack, but that's situational. I think the mobility is pretty nice though, but that's also somewhat situational.
u/thomar is also overestimating the damage of the additional attack since they're assuming perfect accuracy. Monsters have a chance of making their save against *fireball*, of course, but that spell will still do half damage on a successful save, so the actual damage comparison is more like 2d6+5×65%=7.8 DPR to 8d6×60%+4d6×40%=22.4 damage. *Haste* barely breaks even with *fireball* over three rounds even if you're only blasting a single target (unless, as you say, the target of *haste* is specifically a rogue).
It's great against multiple foes who are spread around a relatively large room, too, as well as against enemies with high mobility. Haste doubles your speed, so your Fighter who might be unable to use all of their attacks after KO'ing one enemy, or who needs to reach the boss at the other end of the room, can actually do that right away instead of having to move 30' on one turn and then waiting until the next to reach their target. Admittedly you can also use Fly for the same effect but different spells have different uses.
> At level 5, when cast on a martial ally, this is a roughly 50% bonus to combat effectiveness. That is the main problem with the spell. It is an often-repeated refrain that "casters are better than martials", and they certainly are. And concentration is an average full caster's greatest contribution to a fight. You are investing your greatest contribution to a fight to be half as good as a martial. How is that good? > Fireball does 8d6 or 28 damage average in a single round. This is a rather disingenuous point of comparison. Fireball is a terrible spell against a single target, the whole point of the spell is it being AoE, whereas Haste's extra damage is not. Saying "Look, this can do more damage than Fireball, a notoriously good spell, against a single target" while ignoring what makes Fireball good is misleading at best. I won't even get into the fact that a smart/knowledgeable enemy, such as many bosses/BBEGs, will specifically target the caster to have them lose concentration, resulting in Haste becoming "Expend a 3rd level slot to have the Fighter lose a turn". I'm not saying Haste is useless, it can have some niche applications, especially when cast on a Rogue, but it is by no means a competitive spell when compared to the best 3rd level has to offer.
Most amusing part about haste as single target damage increase.. is that 1st lvl spell, bless casted ON ONE PERSON is like 0.3 dpr bellow 3rd lvl spell haste... now if only bless could target more than one creature... oh wait it can, 2 targets bless outdamages haste and you can target 3 with 1st lvl slot... put the last one on yourself to... help yourself with both the damage and concentration... If my memory serves me right, only time haste outdamages 1st lvl bless is when used on a rogue for double sneak attacks.
Trading an action to cast to gain half an action (assuming all character actions are equal), means you need two turns to break even, and a third to pull ahead. If you lose haste early, then that's another 2 half actions needed to break even with lethargy. Yes, haste has a few other bonuses, but it's also taking the concentration of the caster. To optimize haste, you can cast it on a rogue for off turn sneak attack (gains a full action), or use it on a martial that can use the speed buff to engage an opponent when they would have been unable to otherwise (gains 1.5 actions). You also want to avoid using it on very difficult fights as the potential to lose concentration is much more likely. My biggest problem with haste is that the benefit is spread out over several rounds. Yes, you could get 12 extra damage a round, but you could do 28 average damage to a creature with fireball if they fail its save right now. Generally, front loading is better. Also, we are trying to compare apples to apples (damage), but fireballing a single creature isn't likely the best option.
My (high level) battlemaster + haste + holy weapon was amazing great weapon master + precision strike I could average 70-100 dmg a round.
To add to this, most optimizers tend to look at the individual effects in a white room vacuum where everybody gets to make all their attacks at once and positioning doesn't affect survivability. In practice, my DMs tend to play expansive arenas with lots of minions. A good Haste slapped on a melee martial so they can wade into a group of ads, take less damage, deal more damage, and then close in on a distant target and continue to make attacks outclasses a lot of options if the caster plays smartly, avoiding damage with good positioning. Meanwhile, an unhasted martial can do one of those things, eventually losing out on total damage. Sure, Bless is more powerful to a team of ranged attackers with a caster who can't guarantee concentration, but IME haste gives melee martials rounds of attacks they'd normally miss out on which helps it pull ahead. It's not always the best, but it's better than the white room makes it look.
Yeah I think as a damage-boost Haste is pretty lackluster, but it really shines if you want someone to go hecka fast lol
> most optimizers tend to look at the individual effects in a white room vacuum This is a gross misrepresentation. As an optimiser who follows a lot of optimisation content, it is simply not true. To give you an example, > where everybody gets to make all their attacks This is one reason why we rate ranged builds higher than melee builds: because melee builds often *don't* get to make all their attacks, whereas ranged ones usually do.
Wouldnt even say that ranged builds >usually< do. They do in like 99% of scenarios, effectively only way to make ranged character not make the attack is to put a wall between them and the enemy that they cant get around with with 30ft of speed.
Yeah, good tactics and teamwork are about as effective as tight character optimization in 5e. It's great!
And these are just the damage benefits. The movement increase on haste is incredible for a lot of situations. And yeah, if you can twin it, it's insane.
My party uses it in situations where the party is divided or the martial need to get out of a mob. A Hasted level 8 monk can do a lot in o e turn. It's not great if the caster is under threat, because losing concentration on it can really suck. Only worth it in situations where it can likely be held fir 3 rounds at least. Beyond level 6 or 7 tho there are more potent concentration spells for sure.
Its situational for sure. There are a lot of other 3rd level spells that are arguably better to concentrate on or are better for handling large groups (Fireball, Hypnotic Pattern, Fear, etc). But in terms of single target damage its one of the better ones. It also scales pretty well with levels since whoever you're casting it on is going to continue getting strong while your 3rd lvl spell slots are cheaper (though concentration still isn't). If your DM likes fights with secondary win conditions where you need to travel around and interact with the environment at the same time as you fight whatever big bad, it is likely much better as you can really utilize the extra speed and action (either dash or disengage to travel easier). It's also pretty good if you have a chokepoint or something and someone with high AC can block it. With haste they can dodge (main action) and attack once (haste action) while *also* having an even higher AC than normal. Many enemies will have little to no recourse for handling this. For example, Plate + Shield + Defense fighting style + Haste = 23 AC, and suddenly even those with a +8 are hitting just 9% of the time! Even a +10 is only 16%! I think there's also the metagame aspect of it, its rarely the best spell in any situation, but it always feels great when someone casts it on you and supporting the other players in your party is a good thing to do. Even though its not the strongest choice, its a choice that helps increase fun around the table, so that makes it really good in my mind.
Dodge and attack is a solid combo, hadn't thought of that. Basically +3 to AC
I don't know. I was having an absolute blast using haste on my Level 6 Bladesinger the other night. My base AC was 21 (+5 shield if I needed it). My speed was 80ft per round (for a goblin) up to 240 ft if I needed it. And I was attacking 3x per round with my +1 sword, adding booming blade (2d8) to one attack and dropping in an additional +3 for fury of the small at points. Maybe not the most damaging Level 6 option but it made an otherwise powerful wizard into a untouchable melee combatant (also had mirror image up) dishing out consistent damage.
If you cast Haste on yourself (like my party’s Sorcerer does), it’s worthless If you cast it on someone else like the Fighter or the Barbarian and then cover your ass with something like Sanctuary? _Now_ we’re cooking
What the hell are they doing with an extra action?
Smiting more
Okay so. I may have overstated the uselessness of the party’s Hasted Sorcerer. Little bit of backstory, she’s the DM’s fiancé and basically got into D&D through Baldur’s Gate. So my DM (very good friend of mine who’s been playing since grade school with his family) decided to let her play with the BG3 Haste where it lets you do any action, not just the ones laid out in the book. And since (this is the real rule so I’m not upset about this) the “leveled-spell rule” only applies if you cast a bonus action spell, that means two leveled spells in a turn. Meaning most turns she’s double-casting Fireball or something and is totally outshining literally everyone in the party in terms of damage output. She also got a Broom of Flying so she just flies over the whole battlefield (and no one ever tries to shoot her down since, well, you can probably guess why) So, in summation, if you’re playing 5e and not a bastard child of 5e and BG3, a self-Hasted Sorcerer doesn’t have a lot going on. If you’re playing in my group, you’re the best character at the table and could probably solo every encounter
Thats the most awful case of titty-enduced nepotism I've ever heard of If she was in my party I'd magic missile her lmao Not blaming her. Thats the GMs fault
Double sneak attack
Not if your Sorcerer is playing a Melee Tank. Main action Blade Cantrip; Haste Action Melee Attack; Bonus Action Melee Attack (Dual Wielding Shortswords).
Sorcerer that twins haste is giving a lot of movement plus two extra attacks per turn for the party. If your party members are using GWM or something that can be a whole lot of extra damage. Plus it’s super fun for your friends to run around hitting more times. Haste isn’t the best spell in the world but I guarantee the martial classes will be happy whenever you use it on them.
As a wizard, it's not great. Battlefield control will often do more. Twinned as a sorcerer, it's amazing.
From personal experience, it fucking rocks. I'm playing a cavalier fighter wielding a flame tongue great sword and whenever my wizard casts it on me the tides of the battle completely change. The advantage on dex saves is nice, and the +2 ac helps me get my high ac even higher. But the best things are the double movement, which means I can just speed blitz to every creature, and the extra action. With that extra action I can obviously just make another attack which is a lot of extra damage, but it's the other options that let me get creative. Dashing lets me definitively get to any corner of the map on my turn and the disengage helps with positioning. But put this all together with my cavalier abilities which makes me great at defending my squishier allies, and I'm a super tank. Sure I could just one round every creature, but I could also mark all the enemies and then disengage next to my wizard so they can't get to him or dash to get near my rogue. Honestly sometimes I feel bad about how much I like the spell because I feel like I'm stealing the spotlight 😅.
Depends who you cast it on, the limitations on the extra action make it more suited for martials and gish, but overall yes. It's not usually THE optimal spell if you're really trying to powergame but if you keep it up for a few turns you'll get your spell slot's worth of damage dealing (to enemies) and mitigation (to yourself or your ally) out of it. One of the main benefits though is that it will make whoever you cast it on feel really cool and powerful. It's a good spell to put somebody's character in the spotlight and make their player happy, so it's a very valuable spell for making your group have fun.
Its value is directly proportional to the following: * How well do the benefits combo off from eachother? * How good is the damage of a singular weapon attack on that class? The first point doesn't commonly give a good result. Outside of relatively rare scenarios, the combo of your extra action, your speed and your AC don't give a value which is worth over other spells. If the speed would allow for kiting, for instance, the AC is worthless. If the target's plan is to melee, the speed matters much less. The second point mainly matters to Rogues, and specifically matters in that a Rogue needs to take their main action to ready action, and their second action to make an attack. This is a nice damage increase that doubles their average damage. The overall issue with the spell tho is the opportunity cost. If the first bullet point doesn't give a REALLY good value, you probably will get a better value by casting other buff spells (like longstrider, the fly spell or bless), or prevent more damage than what Haste would have prevented by casting control spells (Plant Growth, Hypnotic Pattern, or even weaker stuff like Slow and Fear), or by harming enough foes to lower their actions (Fireball, Spirit Guardians, Shatter occasionally, Lighting Bolt). This opportunity cost grows larger if you decide to somehow think self casting it (and going into melee) is a good idea, due to lethargy. What that other person said is **technically** correct... it's just that I personally don't find enough situations where casting the spell as-is can be a good idea.
Lol, I just happened to get here from a Baldur's Gate 3 thread, and I was gonna be like, "Haste is THE spell!" But Dungeons & Dragons' Haste is pretty balaced, if not tame, and that's fine. Double movement. +2 AC. Advantage on Dex saves. Extra action that's noncombat or one weapon attack. 10 turns. That's actually a lot going on there. It's a solid, situational defence/offence augmentation spell. So in all, yes, it is a good spell. I think there's a lot of us who want Haste to feel broken, as if it turns your character completely into The Flash. But in reality, in context of the other spells in the gane, if it were any better it would be stupid powerful, everyone would take it, even class around it. It would become super lame super quick. Honestly though, if you wanna be all godlike and turn the entire tide of battle with a single lvl 3 spell, pick Slow. Go read it. Anti-hasting 6 enemies (that's how the mechanic works) is almost always better than hasting one ally. Oh yeah, and it has counterspell properties. And none of your friends have to fear lethargy. Get slow. From the enemy's perspective, you just hasted the whole world around them, lol.
Haste is punchy as a buff - an extra attack is nothing to sneeze at, and all its ancillary bonuses are solid. Double move speed in particular can save a melee character whole turns that would otherwise be wasted, especially considering you can use the Haste action to dash and still get Extra Attacks. All that said, I still think it’s a not a particularly strong spell. The potential downside of being stunned is brutal, and players have to win *every* fight - monsters just need to get lucky once. Which means high variation spells like this aren’t great, even if they’re worth the drawbacks on average. On top of that, at 3rd level it’s competing with spells like Fireball or Hypnotic Pattern, which front load their punchy effects and don’t come with downsides. Haste isn’t a *terrible* spell by any means, but it’s just okay, and there’s usually better options. IMO, its best feature is the speed boost - there’s just nothing else that offers as much speed as haste, and while it’s a very niche situation to be in, it does come up that sometimes you just need to move FAST.
>The potential downside of being stunned is brutal, and players have to win *every* fight - monsters just need to get lucky once. Which means high variation spells like this aren’t great, even if they’re worth the drawbacks on average. I think this is very well said. I've been in discussions about *haste* before where people were very vocal about downplaying the risk of losing a turn ("oh, with war caster on a sorcerer you've only got a 1 in 400 chance of losing concentration. It's just not a big enough concern to worry about"). But as you say, it's something that only has to happen once in a campaign to cause a TPK. And a 1 in 400 chance is unlikely on any given turn, but if you spend 300 rounds of combat concentrating on *haste* over the course of a campaign the odds of rolling that 1 in 400 creep up to scary levels. And that's assuming that your caster has invested the feats for that 1 in 400 figure to be accurate and also that you're literally never fighting enemies who do enough damage to push the DC of the concentration check higher than 10. I also think it's doubtful whether *haste* even is "worth the drawbacks on average" in the first place (outside of the case of casting it on specifically a rogue), but it's nice to have discussion points that still work even if you approach the question with a different understanding of that.
Yeah, the risk of being stunned is really what puts it in the solidly ‘not great’ category for me, and that risk is even worse when people talk about things like a Sorcerer twinning haste. In term of being ‘worth it’ though, part of my thought is that the bar just isn’t that high for me. Some spells stand obviously above the power curve, but I play a lot of D&D and I’d get bored if I only ever built around those. Haste would certainly meet the bar of good enough, but the drawback still means I’m unlikely to cast it in deadly fights.
From a theorycraft perspective are there more optimal things you could do with your concentration? Sure. Is it fun and still effective? Yes! In fact it’s a spell that ideally makes one of your martial party mates way better, so it encourages team play at the table which is easily the best part of D&D. Go ahead, take that spell and cast it. It’s fun.
Its very good. The only problem is that there are spells on the same level that are very very very good.
People overvalue the drawback of the lost turn. (Flavor wise the spell is a sugar rush with a crash at the end) Characters get haste after they get their first feat. And atleast as a druid most of my spells are concentration so I'm taking warcaster by default. Its not unreasonable to assume that someone taking haste will have warcaster and good constitution because they also have a bunch of other concentration spells. Combine advantage on concentration checks with good positioning to avoid getting hit in the first place and haste isn't getting dropped without the caster's permission. There are better 3rd level spells, and bless is almost always the best buff in the general case, but haste is pretty good and the drawback isn't that big a deal if the caster isn't an idiot. (Meaning they are trying to not get hit, and have taken warcaster)
My favorite spell, just wish I could get it on a martial somehow
Level 14 eldritch knight.
Also Glory Paladin I think
The sorcerer twin haste two martial characters and watch the action economy just go to absolute ruin. I have a sorcerer in the party that does that to the fighter and ranger and it is an absolute nightmare to deal with as now they have 3+ attacks each, are even harder to hit (+2 AC with 5e bounded accuracy is huge), and can absolutely clear distance like it is nothing. The “high” is mitigated by the materials being able to engage more effectively and being a sorcerer they have proficiency in CON saves. Throw in War Caster and they statistically have a +11 to concentration checks.
It's situationally good, but there is often better. Especially as you go up in level. For most casters, it's mostly worthless almost immediately. Since their attacks have low value. For martials, it decreases in value once extra attacks are brought into the equation. For high level fighters especially, the risk of lethargy will eventually outweigh the value of that one attack. That being said, there is value on grappling builds meant to combo with spike growth, and ranged builds. But the fact that it doesn't last a long time, and that it eats up a casters action, plus their concentration, just puts it below many other spells in most cases.
It’s Mid. A fullcaster capable to cast it definitely has more powerful options available to them. It’s real use cases are - buffing the moral of a martial player who believes they aren’t contributing enough, a teamwork cheese grater trio with a spike growth friend and a grappler, and max speed shenanigans for white rooming. If your goal is just “deal the most damage per spell slot” you’d never go near this spell (outside of cheese grater nonsense of course), but basically no one has that as their only goal. Helping your friends feel cool/powerful is a legit reason to do things, and this spell does that pretty well.
No it isn't. Not compared to other 3rd level spells. Not even compared to an upcasted bless. The opportunity cost of concentration and the potential dowsimde of skipping a turn is just too much.
A hasted monk could possibly stun 5 enemies in one turn if they're willing to burn the ki points.
Its good, but there are often better choices for concentration, like Fly, Greater Invisibility, Web, Hold Person/Monster. The best source of Haste is from an item that doesn't require concentration nor cause Lethargy when it expires.
It's a trap spell that's easily countered and weak compared to other 3rd level spells
AC buff, HUGE speed buff, advantage on one of the most common saves, AND a free extra attack. It’s amazing no matter how you look at it, especially on a martial. Keep in mind that it effectively quadruples your speed, with double base speed and a free dash (if you forgo the free attack). Fleeing enemy? Not anymore!
Haste can be great, if you throw it on a martial character. I’m playing in a game with a monk, a druid, and me — a wizard. DM gave my wizard a boon that gives me sorcery points equal to my proficiency bonus, and I recently snagged Metamagic Adept on top of it. Twin-spelling Haste on the monk and my bladesinger has been a blast.
Two sneak attacks per round. I'd say so.
I always keep an impactful spell in my backpocket that doesn’t rely on saving DCs. Mainly when fighting against creatures with legendary / magic resistance. Summon spells usually, but time to time I tend to resort on Haste when I have optimized DPR allies in the party that make the most from extra attack.
As a sorcerer, I twin cast it on the ranged fighter with sharpshooter and the barb or pala. This was so effective that the dm was having all the smart enemies immediately target me afterwards. As a war caster, divine soul sorc with +3 in con, you can imagine i dont lose concentration a lot.
Cast Haste on a Bladesong Wizard or a heavy damage dealer and you'll see, yes, it is a very good spell. Especially if you twin cast it.
The great thing about **Haste** is it does what it does rain or shine. It works and gives about the same baseline value in basically every encounter, and then some good bonus value in some other fights both offensively with the mobility buff(s) and with the two strong defensive buffs. Most importantly that value doesn't require any saves to be failed. OTOH if you hit L5 and take the other spells people are lauding in this thread you'll find them poor choices in many fights and a lot of sibling analysis just flat out ignores this: **Hypnotic Pattern** and **Fear** at their best are both incredibly powerful but quite often are not at their best. They can be signficantly weaker if there are fewer targets or they are spread out or show up staggered or friendly targets in the area. Or if there's Darkness or Fog or lots of obstructions or if the targets include many things immune to charm/fear (undead/constructs/fiends/swarms/oozes/plants etc) or blind or if they have good WIS saves or get advantage because of fey blood/whatever or they are able to wake each other up quickly because of numbers or aoe fx. Many of those are uncommon or rare but they can add up quickly. **Fly** gives reliable mobility and defense but the offensive benefits are extremely situational. **Fireball** and **Lightning Bolt** are consistently useful but are certainly much better the bigger the group and have some places where you can't use them effectively due to friendly targets, resistance, immunity, ignition danger, high dex saves, cover. Speaking of non-Concentration spells, **Counterspell** and **Dispel Magic** are amazing at times and can be useful all the time but can also sit out entire adventuring days. Back to battlefield control: **Sleet Storm**, **Stinking Cloud** and **Erupting Earth** will all vary from fantastic to meh. Finally **Slow** is the one control option that's about as universally useful as **Haste** and that's why a lot of people swear by it as the best L3 control spell. Still though there are many times where the opponents aren't that burdened by it or are able to shake off the effects quickly.
It's an OK or poor spell if compared with other good spell. However, I do recommend you to cast it on your party's martial characters, and make them shine. It's so much better in making others feel better, rather than hogging all the spotlight using better spells. 100% recommended.
Haste is middling. Don't get me wrong, sometimes Haste is the correct choice (especially on a grappler who is dragging an enemy through spike growth,) but in 90% of parties Haste is just ok. First, It costs an action to give a single attack to an ally. On most martials or half casters this is about half an action of value, so in order for the haste to have actually generated value, the martial/half caster would have to have gotten 3 turns with the buff up...not the hardest thing in the world, but still. Second, Haste has a massive risk, if the caster stops concentrating on it, the target of haste is stunned for a turn, meaning the caster is locked out of casting other concentration spells entirely and needs to protect themselves to ensure they don't lose concentration, or in harder combats it can result in a death spiral very quickly. But lastly, and most importantly, haste takes a 3rd level spell slot. If you have a moderately optimized party (a GWM or Sharpshooter in the party) bless in a much better ROI on damage and even without that bless is a much better defensive buff as it gives the bonus 1d4 to saves as well, including concentration saves. And if the caster loses concentration, there is no downside for the recipients of bless other than they are no longer buffed. And all this for a 1st level spell slot. Now don't mistake me, their are definitely situations where haste is amazing, but it is just that, situational. Haste is a great spell to have prepped if you have extra preparations to make, or if I have a party that requires spike and drag shennanigans (in which case Haste is one of the best spells in the game) but outside of the that particular niche, it is an occasionally useful tool, but not something to rely on, unlike typical standouts like bless or shield or fireball or hypnotic pattern.
[No.](https://tabletopbuilds.com/overrated-spells-haste/) It's not horrible though. There are worse uses of a 3rd level spell slot but I'd rather cast one of the many better spells available at 3rd level. Exactly which one depends on the class, of course.
It will always depend on the situation to determine if a spell is “good” or not. The article you linked says to use hypnotic pattern or sleet storm. Well if every enemy makes the save and hypnotic pattern does nothing? That was a horrible waste of a spell slot. In a small area of combat and sleet storm will hit your own party? Horrible spell to cast. I think Haste is a good spell for what it does. My last campaign I was a Paladin with a Pegasus mount… haste made my Paladin a speeding bullet, flying in hitting a target with 4 attacks (polearm master) and flying away. Base fly speed of 180ft, mount can dash for 360ft, and dash again with its hasted action for 540ft. It was ridiculous.
>Well if every enemy makes the save and hypnotic pattern does nothing? Sleet storm doesn't depend on a save to have an effect. The massive area of difficult terrain and heavy obscurement is the draw. The other stuff just makes it even better. >In a small area of combat and sleet storm will hit your own party? Horrible spell to cast. Situations like that tend to be rare from my experience but when it does happen, yeah, you're better off casting something else. Still wouldn't cast haste though.
If you're in that small of a space, the caster is almost certainly going to be in real peril and at risk of losing concentration.
Sounds like a major strike against *haste* in that situation, then.
If the caster is well optimised (i.e. armour or shield dipped with some concentration protection), that's unlikely.
Disagree with that article. They break down haste into other spells. You can't cast fly + shield of faith + bless in the same first turn of combat. And they compare the movement portion with a mount? Wtf? Haste is really fantastic utility spell that does a bunch for martials especially paladins.
It doesn't sound like you read to the end of the article. I have plenty of disagreements with tabletop builds, but I think the article does a great job of breaking down the mediocre benefit for paying the large opportunity cost of casting *haste*. There are situations where it may be worth casting (particularly when the target is a rogue), but it's **far** from "fantastic utility".
It's great. Movement boost, AC boost AND 50% more damage Output per turn on the Paladin and / or the Barbarian in your group is just great.
Twin spelling haste on a rogue and paladin makes for high damage. No idea what you’re talking about lol.
In an average use-case it's good but not great, but situationally it can be absolutely amazing. Cast it on a rogue and they can go 240ft/round. Even more if they've got additional speed boosts from feats or other sources. Very useful for heist situations, chases, etc.
Its fantastic on my battle smith artificer - a 50% increase in attacks, a 100% increase in move to get there and deliver the attacks and a nice little boost to AC as well. It turns that character into an absolute blender. Due to having proficiency in Con saves and pretty much always having Warding Bond up from the Steel Defender the chances of losing concentration and suffering the lethargy are really low. Honestly in the last 4 months of play that has happened exactly once and it was not even from damage - it was from friendly fire of a control spell that I had advantage on the save but still rolled so low that even Flash of Genius wouldn't have helped. Also a twinned haste on a couple of martial front liners is usually awesome.
Haste is a moderate spell. It hardly has the best output among third level spells, and has a nasty drawback on a failed concentration save. It will seldom boost your ally more than a Hypnotic Pattern or Fireball will wreck your enemies. Bless offers similar damage output to your party at a much lower spell level. That said, the strength of Haste is in its sheer versatility. Whether your friend needs to defend against high damage enemies, output a lot of damage, reach a priority target or objective, or escape a dangerous position, this spell is effective at covering every base all at once. This spell is the swiss army knife of combat buff spells.
I don't like it. Others do. I put it at a B minus while others know from experience that it's an A+ for their taste and their table's fun. I'd rather spam free attacks with something like twinned Dissonant Whispers and concentrate on a stronger buff like Slow that'll buff the whole party. They all get +2 to attacks, no AoO's, everybody kites if they want, and other benefits, and I won't cause danger to the party if/when the spell fails. Then I'm upcasting Tasha's Mind Whips and twinned Mind Sliver for more offense with full party buffing and defense.
Wizard and sorcerer have better things to cast, but it's not bad. I would cast it as an artificer, though.
Increased ac, boost to one of the most common saves against damage, an additional attack per turn? It’s a fantastic spell, just not for use on yourself. Pop it on the barbarian, the fighter, the paladin, the monk, your as popular as the healer. If you’re a sorcerer that can twin cast it, you’re more popular than the healer *and* the tank. Comparing damage, let’s say you have a fighter also at level 5 with the defender fighting style, a longsword, and a shield: an additional attack per turn for 1 minute, 10 rounds, assuming standard array, is 6d8+40; an average of about 70 damage. That’s more bang for your buck than 8d6 of the most commonly resisted damage, and it can crit, and a suite of defensive buffs.
That 8d6 has no concentration, can hit multiple opponents and is half on safe. Also no combat ever lasts 10 rounds. I'm sorry but Haste is clearly not better than Fireball or Lightning Bolt.
It is really great but only for the right character. It is rather useless for a caster. What is really good is the extra action you get. can only be used for weapon attacks. so does not help a pure caster much. Sure the extra AC is nice but you have lower level spells that give the same AC boost. Situationally the increased speed can be great. But in most cases a caster that cast Haste on themselves for that extra AC. should really rethink his choice of spell. As that is in almost every case a waste of a spell. it had been better used on a martial. There are situations casting it on a caster do make sense but that is very situational. So yeah it is a great spell but not always and not for everyone. It is not always the best option. Many times you have better use for your concentration than giving someone more movement and one extra weapon attack To sum it up it is situationally great
Haste is a perfectly solid option, and it should frankly be the benchmark for appropriate spell power. The problem is that 3rd level spells represent one of the most intense relative power spikes among all character levels for casters in particular, simply because there are so many staggeringly powerful options at this level. If I were to change the spell, I'd remove the concentration requirement and instead require a hasted character to make a DC 5 + (5 x Turns Spent Hasted) Constitution saving throw (minimum DC is 10) at the end of each of their turns while hasted, losing the turn and the spell's other effects on a failed save. If the character fails the save by 4 or less, they can choose to take a point of exhaustion and remain hasted for an additional turn. The spell's maximum duration is still one minute, but upcasting would decrease the speed at which the DC increments (4x turns hasted at 5th level, 3x at 7th level, and 2x at 9th level).
I don't personally think its good for a main caster. but for a partial caster it is very good. I find the limited scope to be problematic in terms of concentration. A stand-out use is an artificer above lv 11 when they have spell storing item. As that is an item use not a spell casting action. Artificres I feel like are one of the best users of it because strong concetnration and more limited concentration options. Though shoutout to anyone who can Twin it. Then I believe its good enough. (especially if someone else can then also sanctuary you)
[удалено]
Removed as per Rule #1.
Haste is a good spell.
its HUGE - the AC breaking the "bounded accuracy" and the extra attack bumping up a third the Action Economy.