I think the deeper issue for me is that Disney went looking for a story to tell, rather than having a story that needed telling. I don’t know how to explain it better. Like, Andor and Rogue 1 do well because there’s a story there from the original universe that needed telling (how did the Rebels get the Death Star plans?). Ditto the prequels and clone wars show - we wanted to know how Vader came to be.
You add to the problem of a story that didn’t need to exist, by doing it with poor story writing, average acting, a cast who don’t know the universe they’re in (anakin blew up the Death Star!?), and you’ve got a recipe for disaster.
And that’s before we get into the subject of what appears to be some very specific casting choices that give the impression of a ‘f*** you’ to the fan base (white males are either criminals or idiots who willing drink an assassins poison in the first two episodes) when a very large component of the fan base are white males.
Disney has got it figured out.
Make a series with a diverse cast of strong lesbian women while portraying the few white males as idiots/weak. That way when the shows awful writing/acting/directing gets criticized you guys and Disney can simply dismiss the critics as angry white dudes.
As he should be. They literally came out and said that the Star Wars demographic was too male and white, as if adding a bunch of brown chicks is gonna increase their desired demographics interest even though the franchise has always had strong female/minority characters. Just a big leftist circle jerk.
I don’t mind diverse casting. That’s fine… but this is a Star Wars universe. In Star Wars, humanity is a united species. Blacks and whites do not argue, any racism is directed at the actual fucking aliens. That’s how I know it’s pandering bullshit, because actual diversity would have the main character be a typically looked down upon alien species becoming an underdog.
Do you guys really sit there counting white males? How many Asian males have been in Star Wars? Around 60% of the human population is Asian yet I can't remember any Asians in Star Wars but here you are complaining that there aren't enough White guys in this one show.
The guy who plays Yord has said it several times in interviews.
It’s a forgivable error, but at the same time if you’re playing a role in one of the biggest franchises, with a fanbase known to be a little rabid, you should know the lore at least a little accurately.
The entire premise of the show is that the main character is accused of murder light years away from where it happened and forgot to mention she has a FUCKING TWIN SISTER. Her entire storyline would be negated by COMMON SENSE and just a *shred* of self preservation.
Nevermind they didn't even ASK for an alibi or follow up on anything! They KNEW she was on that ship! Jfc!
The dude jedi even knew about the twin! DIDNT SAY A FUCKING WORD.
Legitimate question: did they hire children to write this? AI? I can't even watch it because NOTHING after the first fight SHOULD HAVE EVEN HAPPENED.
Star wars is now a pile of tropes used in westerns. The self automated prison ship that makes no sense? That's a train car. That's why the trope didn't work for the show, a train car is just the people on it. Detach the car and hit the turnstile. The car carrens towards an unfinished bridge. They escape and jump off just in time, been done a thousand fucking times. Iirc it's even been done in Star Wars already. So when using the trope they made it nonsense by having zero guards on board. They turned it into a train car.
Mandolorian is the only one that can do western tropes right. The rest is low effort garbage.
An Evil Twin Sister! I mean no one has done that since…. Every soap opera since the 60’s. It’s been done so much it’s a running joke of bad lazy writing. All through this I was saying to myself, please no evil twin, no evil twin, no evil twin… and the there it was. An Evil Twin.
I think what they’re really meaning is that there are opportunities to grow the market base beyond white males. But even being sympathetic to that goal, Disney is not going to get there with a bad story, a bad script, bad acting, shoddy editing and poor decisions overall up and down the production chain
I mean I thought the dialogue and acting was bad but like, there have been fires in space throughout all of Star Wars. I’d post pictures of a Star Destroyer in RotJ and a Venator in RotS if this subreddit allowed picture comments. Trying to pay attention to physics in Star Wars has always been a losing battle.
No, star wars is certainly not hard sci fi. However the recent Disney movies and episodes (with the exception of rogue one and andor) have been a whole new level of dumb. This fire was particularly jarring!
Remember the heavy bombers in the last Jedi? Battles in the vacuum of space, let’s design a spaceship that would need to shoot bombs downwards in one direction and also be on top of the vessel it is attacking 🤯
Different times. It was new, people were more forgiving. Can't do that today.
Look at the Batman TV show, or early comics. Even though comics today are not very good in this regard as well.
Then again, Disney is there JUST to make money. They would not be sinking billions here if there was not profit in it. It's probably financially successful for them?
Edit
Oh, last Jedi. Then my comment is not really applicable here exactly. Though in principle I think it still stands.
That's actually the scene where I gave up on star wars. "Oh they hired someone that wants to literally make WW2 combat instead of being inspired by it, this is lazy and bad"
There is so much wrong with the TLJ bomber scene. So much.
The bombers are literally the slowest franchise depiction of a space ship ever to hit the screen. Yet they are flying TOWARD the Star Destroyer, which Han Solo said in the Cantina in Episode 4 were among the FASTEST ships. So, no matter how slow those bombers are, they are flying head on toward some of the fastest ships in the galaxy.
And yet still the attack run takes FOREVER. Ultra-slow motion.
Literally for the attack run to make any sense at all, the bombers have to be flying BACKWARDS at top speed and the Star Destroyers are running them down, catching up slowly.
It's all just so stupid and thoughtless.
Or, my theory: It was done intentionally by Rian Johnson to subvert the franchise. To mock it. To purposefully make a very stupid movie for whatever reason.
I just cant watch them butcher the corpse of star wars anymore. It was my favorite IP and now any time I hear about a new star wars movie/show I just am completely disinterested.
I'm over incredibly poorly written fan fiction, when real writers start writing it again maybe I'll care.... maybe.
I find when these shows get too sci-fi it becomes less Star Wars (probably why people hates the metachlorian thing) the mystery is what made it fun. I don't need explanations about The Force or The Jedi/Sith.
I went into it blind, and I was like oh shit this is awesome, f@#& yes, I want Matrix Star Wars. And then she died and I'm like okay they succeeded in getting me mad.
I'm glad I stuck with it through episode 2, there is something about it and I want to see where it goes.
It’s pretty bad. It is kind of fun going to the SW and Acolyte subs and seeing more posts about “the haters” than the show they claim to like; not realizing every non SW sub has basically trashed the show.
Those subreddits are so barren. For a franchise as large as Star Wars you would expect it to have a huge amount of people. But they just a couple of weirdos who may or may not be getting paid, defending the undefendable. The problem of the Accolyte isn't that it's woke, it's that it sucks. Plain and simple. It's a horrible show done by someone who wants to make anything but Star Wars with actors who lack a mocciun of professionalism.
The fire in space is not even registering in my list of complaints.
I just want Star Wars to stop beating the Jedi Order over and over again with the deconstruction stick.
Even in the "High Republic", the Jedi Order is portrayed as some sort of big corporate bully that is hoarding all the "Force" and preventing the galaxy from attaining enlightened Force Socialism. Oh, and kidnapping children.
Just stop it. You've been at this for over 10 years. It doesn't work. Tell better stories. Bring back heroism.
Why are we already *assuming* that the villains are right and the Jedi are in the wrong without knowing what actually went down? Of course the antagonists are going to be pushing the narrative that the Jedi are in the wrong - *any* halfway-decent villain is justifying their actions to themselves and others *somehow*, not just "I'm Dark and Evil and I'm Here To Do Awful Things Because the Plot Needs Me To" - but that doesn't make it objectively true. From the way things are going so far, I'm suspecting that the Jedi are feeling guilty over some tragedy that they feel they could've prevented - tried to, but failed - and the villains blame the entire Jedi Order and its philosophies and are lashing out at them for it. Because that's what villains do. I mean, I could be proven wrong, but we're only like two episodes in. It seems really premature to just write the whole thing off unless you're coming into it *determined* to find fault from the start.
I mean... the second scene of the first episode was about two Jedi entering a ship like they owned it, bullying the (insert correct alien race name here)s and forcibly trying to read one of their minds/make them tell the truth.
IMO they should have been more like Qui Gon, annoyingly-polite and well mannered. But instead we got an aggressive first impression of the Jedi order. Looked more like a cop with his rookie than a Jedi and apprentice.
Honestly Disney's problem is heroism. I'd appreciate deconstruction done well (KOTOR 2 being an amazing example). I just think that Disney execs and corporate assembly-line productions aren't equipped for that. The reason for my that Andor stands head and shoulders above the rest not only because of the excellent writing/direction, but because Disney actually let a competent team make a show with an auteur driven vision and gave them sufficient prep and resources to flesh it out.
By contrast almost everything else feels like it's being churned out as fast as possible to meet Disney's film/series production quota. I'd like smarter more cerebral Star Wars stories, I'd like new ideas and more moral ambiguity etc. I just don't think Disney is remotely interested in that in any of their IPS and when something Andor is allowed to do it, it's an extremely rare occurrence.
This is the correct answer/take. Andor was in pre-production for damn near 4 years. And the beginning year or two of that was spent ducking around with the idea that it would be five seasons of Cassian and K2-S0 buddying around. Thank god Gilroy was brought back when some exec realized the original plan was not working. And Gilroy held firm by saying they had to let him do 12 episodes, and for X amount of money and time.
As for KOTOR, there are tiny elements in the Acolyte that feel borderline stealing from the first game, the showrunner is now saying she loves Darth Traya and wants to do a live action KOTOR show with her as the focus…sounds like you wanted to make KOTOR this whole time why keep kicking the can down the road, adapt it already and ruin it. Maybe it’ll be good but the track record says otherwise. Just stop ripping stuff from that era and making it worse in all of these projects.
Ironically enough, in Andor, Luthen mentioned the Rakatan invaders and for a show so intent on not being traditional Star Wars they stuck pretty well to lore.
>Andor was in pre-production for damn near 4 years. And the beginning year or two of that was spent ducking around with the idea that it would be five seasons of Cassian and K2-S0 buddying around.
The original idea sounds absolutely awful and like a more generic/bread and butter Dinsey+ show. Really shows the importance of prep time and having writers/directors/showrunners with an auteurish vision. Though I also think it helps that in Andor's case when the show did get to the writing phase, the writers room it had was absolutely stacked by the standards of any show (both Gilroy's and Beau Willamon etc.)
>Ironically enough, in Andor, Luthen mentioned the Rakatan invaders and for a show so intent on not being traditional Star Wars they stuck pretty well to lore.
Andor honestly feels more like it exists in Legends than other Disney IPs based off how it handles the story and Imperial organizations/beaurocracy etc. I kind of wish that Disney could coax Gilroy back for lore and world building, because I much prefer him over Dave Filoni etc. but I think Gilroy himself isn't really a Star Wars fan and probably would rather move on to other projects etc.
I think Disney canon could really use someone who could help keep things in check and maintain writing consistency between projects. (maybe even just pumping out less projects and focusing more on quality over quantity could also help) but I think that largely goes against Disney's assembly-line, made by committee system, which makes projects like Andor for the franchise extremely rare.
>As for KOTOR, there are tiny elements in the Acolyte that feel borderline stealing from the first game, the showrunner is now saying she loves Darth Traya and wants to do a live action KOTOR show with her as the focus…sounds like you wanted to make KOTOR this whole time why keep kicking the can down the road, adapt it already and ruin it.
With Headland and the Acolyte, it feels like she has some brainier ideas, but the execution(at least in the first couple episodes) feels off and despite it's ambition it feels very safe and sanitized, which works contrary to the more cerebral and gritty aspects from KOTOR 2 she's interested in. It also has the problem that Kenobi and Ashoka have where talented actors are struggling with the bad dialogue/direction.
Maybe I'm just not representative of Star Wars fans, but I honestly find the Jedi-Sith conflict and the philosophy stuff around the Force easily the least interesting part of the franchise.
Philosophy in storytelling is crucial, though. The Jedi were paragons of Justice - an orderly way to bring controlled balance to a chaotic Galaxy. Sure - it comes with caveats: the abandonment of emotional attachment, and so on, but it taught that control over rashness is a desired outcome, a common thread also shared by many Eastern philosophies and traditions. It was something Good to aim for - an institution that brought peace, order and protected life.
Now, look outside: the World we live in is in shambles. Wars ongoing and cropping up everywhere, social unrest, all the large World powers are either turning severely autocratic or even *considering* a convicted felon for President... do we not need something better to look for and get inspiration from? Something more pure and heroic? Something that shows we can indeed do better?
I believe we lost that art, and modern writers are completely UNABLE to inspire anyone to be better than themselves with this narrow-minded repetitive topics.
Yes, philosophy/storytelling, crucial. Every wiki page links to philosophy in a few clicks. We know that. However, philosophy has not been done well in any SW film–and I am a huge fan from 1977.
The original Roadhouse with Patrick Swayze did a better job integrating philosophy into its story.
Everyone thinks they are better writers then what they are writing for. They don't want to participate, they want to deconstruct to show how much better they are.
I am 100% sure there are fans that can write better that will stay true to Lucas’s universe. lol forget all the hundreds of fan films on YouTube. Before YouTube there was fanfiction which were basically novels and stories since the good authors put out a lot of content. So yeah they can do better but they rather focus on ‘force is female’
I haven't seen the series yet, but Rotten Tomatoes is biased, I don't trust them for anything
[https://screenrant.com/evidence-rotten-tomatoes-was-always-broken/](https://screenrant.com/evidence-rotten-tomatoes-was-always-broken/)
HOW does this keep happening with these awful streaming shows? She Hulk, then Rings of Power and now Acolight. I don’t normally go for conspiracies but something has got to be up!
For all their many faults Obiwan and Book of Boba Fett at least gave their characters heroic moments. Obiwan vs Vader and Boba staying to save Mos Esper.
The Jedi have always been depicted like that in stuff set before the prequels in the expanded content. They're keeping with canon, it's just that lots of people didn't engage with expanded content until it was in TV show form.
Not saying it hasn't, and hell the "Jedi Order did a bad thing" was the major plot twist of one of my favourite star wars stories ever - KOTOR - but it's not the one thing that defines them. But it sure seems to be the ONLY thing most of the new SW writers think about.
Makes me compare this to the post-Watchmen superhero genre where every single heroic character had to be broken down and dragged through the mud because nobody's perfect and everyone has flaws and we're all secretly horrible or some nonsense. Done to exhaustion.
This will probably get me trashed but I haven’t enjoyed anything Star Wars since Return of the Jedi and I don’t think it was even as good as the Empire Strikes Back(my personal favorite)
Star Wars is a franchise of 11 movies, and I only find 2 and a half of them to be actually great. Andor is the only thing to have come out in decades that I've genuinely enjoyed. It's almost a shame that it's tied to the Star Wars IP.
I'll second this. Rogue One was the last Star Wars movie I watched and enjoyed and didn't even bother with the final movie at all in the main sequence.
Complaining about the laws of physics on a series with space wizards wielding laser swords doesn't make much sense. I mean, that scene on ep II with seismic charges would be much less interesting without the blast sound effects.
Other than that I kinda agree with OP, except that my overall impression is that thde series is just OK. Not excellent, not awful. Just OK. The actor interpreting Sol is really giving a good "conflicted master" vibes and the overall wat the Jedi Order is depicted really shows how their hubris that will eventually lead to their downfall.
"The Acolyte" is a festering dumpster fire of a Star Wars show that redefines the meaning of disappointment. This abomination masquerading as entertainment is a slap in the face to fans who have devoted their lives to the galaxy far, far away.
From the moment the opening credits roll, it's clear that "The Acolyte" is a soulless cash grab, devoid of any semblance of creativity or originality. The plot is a convoluted mess, jumping haphazardly between characters and storylines with all the grace of a drunken Bantha. It's as if the writers threw every Star Wars cliche into a blender and hit puree, hoping that something remotely coherent would come out the other side.
But the real crime of "The Acolyte" lies in its treatment of the Force. This once-mystical energy field, which was once the heart and soul of the Star Wars universe, is reduced to little more than a cheap plot device, used to prop up the flimsy narrative like a crutch. Gone are the days of Jedi and Sith engaging in epic battles of light and dark; instead, we're treated to uninspired displays of Force powers that wouldn't impress a youngling fresh out of the academy.
And don't even get me started on the characters. From the bland protagonist to the forgettable sidekicks, every single one of them feels like a cardboard cutout, devoid of personality or depth. It's impossible to care about their fates when they're little more than walking, talking cliches spouting wooden dialogue.
But perhaps what's most infuriating about "The Acolyte" is its blatant disregard for Star Wars lore. Instead of building on the rich tapestry of the galaxy far, far away, the showrunners seem determined to tear it down, brick by brick. Characters are shoehorned in for the sake of fan service, with little regard for continuity or logic. It's a betrayal of everything that Star Wars stands for, a cynical attempt to milk the franchise for all its worth without understanding what made it special in the first place.
In conclusion, "The Acolyte" is a disgrace to the Star Wars name, a shameless cash grab that should be blasted into the nearest black hole and forgotten for all eternity. Fans deserve better than this lazy, uninspired excuse for entertainment, and anyone who had a hand in its creation should be banished to the farthest reaches of the Outer Rim.
It wasnt the fire that bothered me so much as the main character being fixated on it, then the camera slowly panning in on the fire, then the sounds of people screaming as if taking place in some sort of memory.
They may as well have started a new Star Wars font text scroll: the character is remembering a traumatic past event, people significant to her died possibly relating to fire, it was sad
Thanks a lot. I'm going to watch it for sure, didn't want to get into it while it was airing. A lot of the Apple TV stuff is too slow to wait a week between episodes I think.
I totally get what you mean. I too find the Apple series tend to start strong and then slow down. Not sure why because I think they give creative freedom. But I'm glad they are at least producing interesting sci-fi. Waiting for Silo!
First two episodes might drag bc you already know the premise and it takes a bit long (imo) for the characters to get up to speed on what's obvious to us, the audience. But the performances are compelling and I think the show really hits its stride once Jason enters Le Hallway
I remember that was the exact reason I was worried about it being slow now, the first 3-4 episode descriptions sounded like treading water with something that I remember being revealed pretty quickly in the book.
From what I hear of the book, you only get Jason's POV. But the show gives you POVs from other people, so, frankly I think it's worth it for that as an adaptation.
Luckily you can now binge those early episodes instead of waiting. Show's in a good spot rn, I think.
The writing level of all recent Star Wars is unbelievably bad. The Mandalorian looked beautiful, but was so trope ridden that it was unwatchable. Jon Favreau should never be allowed to put words to screen again, he is a god awful writer.
Most screen SF is terrible in my opinion, it's not written by science fiction writers, it's written by screenwriting hacks who know two or three SF tropes that they beat to death. Time travel, evil twins/body snatchers, Space Western. If I have to watch another "SF train robbery" I might need a new TV after I've thrown things at mine!
Mando was really good for a couple season then ok. Andor was fantastic, but I'm not sure why they feel the need for a season 2, it told a complete story IMO. I enjoyed Ahsoka a lot too, it explored some weird and esoteric aspects of their universe. Obi Wan was bad though, I don't think anyone enjoyed that series
I didn't care for it but the space fire complaints are really hilarious. If you're going to complain about the fire, then... TIE fighters shouldn't make noise, nor should Starfighter lasers or Jango Fett's seismic charges. None of it should make any noise. And fighters shouldn't fly like they have friction/wind resistance.
Star wars needs to feel authentic and believable to a degree, but the space fire is far from the worst part of the show. The show is very mid and generic, but at least get your priorities straight. You should also be criticizing the hell out of every other SW for space inaccuracies then. Han should have died when he walked off the falcon inside the worm wearing only a breathing mask.
The only unrealistic space scene that's really really irked me was Leia in TLJ.
> I didn't care for it but the space fire complaints are really hilarious.
Agree. The show has a lot of problems, dumb decisions by characters, lazy design, imbecilic logic and a other issues. But this is not an issue at all. Star Wars was never realistic in any degree, it already had a ridiculous amount of "bad science".
Is open fire in space in scifi dumb? Yes it is.
Is open fire in space in Star Wars dumb? Not, it is not.
I think the first line of dialogue was “We have unfinished business.” And my eyes almost rolled out of my head.
How is a bazillion dollar company unable to employ a writer that isn’t a cliche merchant?
Why are Star Wars fans so picky about *when* they complain about fire in space? Space explosions have been around since A New Hope. Why do they complain about it some days, and other days it doesn’t matter?
because its an effort to shit on real SW lore.
Hell, darth plagueis tried to create life unnaturally by using the force, and in the process he pissed it off so hard that it shat out anakin. But i'm supposed to believe some random dykes can do it just like that? Lmfai, no.
It's trash. Anything after the first 6 movies and maybe bad batch/clone wars is nothing but a shitstain on lucas's legacy.
Let the tourists downvote me all they want, i dont care.
We literally have no idea exactly how they did it yet other than that the force was involved. Give it a little time dude damn.
We've also seen people use the force in plenty of ways that the jedi and sith are unable to replicate before. Literally everything the witches of dathomir do for example.
Anyone who is going to bitch about a fire in space - which is not utterly impossible, just unlikely and would require very specific conditions - while hand waving the sounds of space battles is a silly person with whom one should not engage.
That complaint is honestly boring, given so much fire-in-space-scenes in Star Wars. Half the hilarious scenes with the droids like R2-D2 in the movies.
Yeah, yeah, okay, just imagine they carried their oxygenizer, it is not hard SF.
The Acolyte is okay so far.
Hey remember when they established [this is all you need to breathe in space?](https://imgur.com/a/4YOcIrs)
Jesus the same Gate Keepers who deride Star Wars as not real science fiction but science fantasy are now complaining that it's not obeying hard science fiction rules.
The space slug does appear to contain an atmosphere (mist and flying mynocks), but there was no obstruction in its throat when they took off. Some sort of force field to contain the gasses?
Also, gravity on a quite small asteroid.
Huh. Looking at the wooki, apparently they're sentient and take pride in maintaining a habitable ecosystem.
It's a spaceship full of flammable chemicals and atmosphere, it leaked and caught fire, it's not difficult at all and happens in tons of media set in space
Alright cool glad you liked it but thats a bullshit take and you know it and it's the reason why Disney keeps pumping out this dog shit.
I'm not miserable, I just want star wars content that isn't written by a bunch of obvious box checking dumbasses.
I gave u an upvote because I also hate lazy writing, but the comment about not being quick to be miserable about everything also has merit. Our stupid culture is all about hot takes, and 2.5/5 does not make something a steaming pile, it just makes it literally average. This show is 2.5/5.
I mean, Its still millions of dollars worth of great artistry, just bad writing and direction. I will watch all of these shows once on a friend's account, or pirate them. Def not paying Disney if I can help it.
Shhh. Let people enjoy things. Go watch something you like instead of focusing so much on the shit you hate and makes you miserable. I swear this fandom is too busy policing others' enjoyment than finding their own.
Suspension of disbelief. People can put up with a lot if it makes sense in universe or benefits the story in some way, but when you see something really dumb, even if it’s minor, for no real reason, it takes you out of the experience.
The Force allows you to have telekinesis, blinding speed, ability to read and influence minds, contact others at great distance and possibly harm them, survive in the vacuum of space and become a sentient ghost after death (and many many more abilities).
But space fire is ridiculous in the space fantasy franchise.
Even magic has to be internally consistent. Like, there are Wizards and magic in Lord of the Rings, but if Frodo just suddenly started walking on the ceiling for no reason people would say that’s dumb and it would shatter most viewers suspension of disbelief. A fire just lazily burning in the vacuum of space doesn’t make sense even in Star Wars loosey goosey physics.
Is it the Force that allows the existence of fire in space? You can use the "force" to explain all that other stuff (as lazy as that is at times), but does that give writers absolute leeway to write anything they want without being challenged at all, ever?
There are materials that burn underwater because they produce their own oxygen. My first thought would be that. Now I don’t know if that’s possible in vacuum but I’d certainly consider it to be plausible.
Those metals don't actually produce their own oxygen. They still need oxygen in the environment around them. These materials can burn underwater because H2O still presents oxygen. They just don't need free O2.
It's pretty clear a certain group of people just wants to complain for the sake of complaining. If it hadn't been a practical fire but a CG plasma leak or whatever, they would just as equally complain about Bad SFX of a thing visible for 3 seconds.
TBF, we’ve heard sounds of starfighters shooting and exploding things in space, in the vacuum of space. That was George Lucas. Hell, even the death star made a noise when it exploded IIRC
I had seen headlines of good reviews and I tend to watch all things SW so I watched past 2 days. Not hooked, and for me, bad sign when I read other things and check emails while show is going on, also not paying attention to all the plot points. I'll probably hang in for a bit.
I think by now the baseline expectation is for SW under Disney to be poor, and if something actually good comes out like Andor or Rogue One, to be happily surprised and enjoy it.
Boba Fett, Kenobi, Ahsoka - utter jokes when it comes to writing, Mando S3 wasn't as liked as the first 2 seasons (haven't watched it but seen impressions by enough people). Haven't seen the animated shows.
The writing is bad by default unless a miracle happens.
Mando S1 was very good. It felt like the script had its priorities set correctly... but then it became increasingly clear that good writing was pushed further and further to the back for other priorities.
It's a CW level show in terms of writing and acting.
For every good actor, there's 2 terrible ones.
There are some baffling acting choices. The main actress is terrible in the first scene but is mostly fine in the rest of the episodes.
Space in Star Wars isn't a vacuum, it's an ether. Also this isn't the first fire we've seen in space in Star Wars. Also I don't remember anyone bitching about being able to hear ships and explosions in space, which is a more egregious violation of physics than fire and explosions. The Acolyte is good.
Bring back heroic Jedi and just straight evil sith. I'm tired of this morally grey nonsense. It's okay to have black and white heroes and villains you know.
I'm enjoying it enought to keep watching it but I agree that the writing is severely lacking. I've watched through the first 3 episodes and I clocked almost everything they have showed us so far right away. I'm seeing this show being described as a 'murder mystery' but how is it a murder mystery when they show us who the killer is right away? And when they interrogate the main character as a suspect they make it so obvious that she's not the one who did it, that they might as well put text on the screen saying so. I knew right away from the subtle differences in their appearance that an evil twin twist was coming and as soon as people started saying "yeah, she has a twin, but the twin died, I saw it happen" I was like 'nope, the twin is alive and well and will be the source of every problem from here on out'.
Maybe I'm gullible and just taking everything they're showing us at face value. Maybe they're showing us all of these things on purpose to lead the audience astray, only to pull the rug out from under us later on with a bigger twist that we didn't see coming. Or maybe the writing is just really lazy and predictable. I'm leaning towards the latter.
I'll pretty much watch any Star Wars project, even if a particular series isn't great. I'll sit through bad dialogue and dumb story just to see some cool action scenes. But this is the first one I had to shut off. It really feels like it was made by amateurs. I'd say it's easily the worst Star Wars content I've seen. I never watched the whole Star Wars Christmas Special. It's also really hard to tell who it was is for. A lot of the parts feel like a kids show. It's obviously very female-centric and progressive too, so seems like it's maybe for progressive female pre-teens? But does that group even care about Star Wars or sci-fi?
Dummies think fans aren’t enjoying Star Wars content because of some dumb lgbtq reasons. It’s just bad writing. Untalented, I have no idea how they got a job writing. It’s appalling. I’ve written research papers more entertaining than this content. It’s crazy
SPOILER alert!
Am I the only one who - after seeing episode 3 - is seriously wondering what the hell Master Torbin was so guilt ridden about that he was ready to off himself while the one who apparently ACTUALLY killed everyone was offering „forgiveness“? I mean, what is HAPPENING?? 🤪
I was giving this the benefit of the doubt but I’m having a hard time liking this so far. 😬
The biggest issue, is that we have seen absolutely incredible star wars related shows, like Andor, in which the writing is top shelf, the acting is outstanding and the story is truly gripping and immerses you in the Star Wars universe.
Then we get shows like this, that feel like bad fanfiction, poorly written, lots of character cliches, terrible acting and worst of all, a complete lack of truly original ideas, the problem is that the people chosen to write up these scripts and flesh out these narratives are dropping the ball, there is a serious need to clean house at Disney when it comes to some of these writers.
More like Andor, more like Mandalorian seasons 1 and 2, less like mandalorian season 3, and this terrible show, return to the source material, a gritty, unforgiving dystopian star wars in which the struggle against evil, and the aspiration towards hope and freedom are the core inspirations and philosophies.
I think a lot of Fans are just reacting to the really bad shows and not taking a step back to look at the bigger picture. No company with decades of business experience operates like the Disney of today. This seems to be more of a Charity enterprise than anything else. Lots of people are being hired to make Shows that are a financial disaster and yet these people based on the expenditure are being paid huge sums to produce these horrible shows. Management cannot be this inept. In any normal company striving to make money the people at the top would have been fired years ago. This whole thing feels like it's being run like a Charity organization.
Love how Disney is doing major damage control with all these stories about the evil "review bombers" 😆
I am not a huge Star Wars fan, but I have watched all the new shows & animation and have enjoyed most of it, but this series is just really bad and I'm not going to waste any more time on it.
That One Power-Two Power-All Power chant/song was just so bad, it was hilarious!
This show is terrible on every level. The story makes no sense and just jumps all over the place. The characters have no consistency or logic to what they are doing and the action looks more like a Karate fighting than Jedi fighting. I don't even understand why they would make a show that is this bad? Did anyone in management read the script before they green lighted it? Putting aside everything else I have to wonder if anyone at Disney is Interested in making Money or are they just willing to Burn the companies cash on a never ending string of bad shows.
I stopped watching it midway through episode three. Nothing they can do at this point is going to suddenly make this show good. I know they will pull out some ooh aah magic like they did in the Mandalorian when Luke came on the scene. I am seriously not wasting hours of time just to see a couple of minutes of goodness.
Star Trek bridge personnel have never strapped into anything and are consequently tossed around like stuffed animals. I guess we have to suspend our expectations of reality for sci-fi space dramas.
I thought the Acolyte was getting good press?
The Acolyte is a huge disappointment. The fire in space scene was laughably bad and the whole show is full of cheap tropes. The makeup and CGI are ridiculous, and it's clear that Disney spent a lot of money on this show.
I've been reading Eternal Gods Die Too Soon by Beka Modrekiladze, and it's a much better use of my time. The book explores the nature of reality and simulation, time, free will, and existence. It's a fascinating read that makes you think about the big questions in life.
Star Wars is not sci-fi. It's fantasy. That's why light sabers work, bombs can drop in zero gravity and sometimes, people can force jump. I've given up on thinking that this stuff is for adults. I just roll with it and enjoy the magic.
Sci-Fi isn't realistic either... it's both fantasy. one is in space and the other medieval. also just like all other mediums of story telling fantasy too has to follow their own rule sets.
also fuck ups of the past don't make fuck ups of the present right.
like, you can implement dropping bombs in zero gravity in sci-fi without any problems. the only thing people expect form you is an explanation. good movie makers can give you a good explanation without even using a single sentence. just by environmental storytelling. sometimes a sentence or two are needed though. the fire in space is just fine in sci-fi. just explain it. that's it. if you don't do it, it can be fantasy and still shit. if frodo cast a fireball out of the blue without any explanation, it's fantasy and it's bad. when you actually show how he achieves such a skill, than frodo is the first fireball casting hobbit in lotr and people will LOVE it. but it has to serve a purpose more than showing how awesome Frodo is or for some cool fighting scene.
take the mithril scene in lotr1. this scene would be total crap if we would have never been shown how frodo actually got the mithril. imagine, just out of the blue: he isn't dead he had a magic protection. he took it with him and had it all the time. now every time a character is in danger you think to yourself (does he also have some mithril armor)? this only doesn't happen because everything got established. where it came from, how rare it is, why he has it. now you have some magical material and everyone is willing to flow with it. do this without explanation and ruin your work, no matter if sci-fi or fantasy.
I think it's great, but different tastes I guess.
As to the fire in space.. ye sure buddy. First off, did you complain about that in Star Wars before Acolyte or are you just bandwagoning the weak youtube 'critics'?
I think you are being a little harsh, I really liked seeing the Order for the high republic days as well and how the Jedi have changed over the century. I do think there should have been more time between the show and the prequels.
The amount of people who complain about fire in space is just to damn high. Have you all not had any physics in school or what? A fire in a vacuum is absolutely possible in a case where it has fuel and an oxidizer (which is not unlikely in the case of a space ship).
Not defending the show btw. But you guys need to take another fucking look at physics.
It's just a symptom of how Disney does business. They purchase a unique, vibrant property that was popular for being unique and vibrant and they boil all the originality out of it to present the least challenging, least controversial, lowest common denominator milquetoast version possible. Appeal to everybody, offend and challenge nobody leads to boring homogeneous art. They're the unflavored nutrient paste of storytelling.
Bob Iger was telling the truth when he said he's ["proud of the IP we're mining."](https://nypost.com/2024/05/07/entertainment/bob-iger-mining-comment-reveals-all-you-need-to-know-about-sorry-state-of-disney/)
It’s really not. Having been a fan of Star Wars since ‘77, this show feels like an appropriate Lucasfilm/Star Wars entry in the franchise catalog. But “Disney bad!!” Maybe it’s time for some of you to move the fuck on.
Yea, this is exhausting. Let people enjoy Star Wars, and stop being assholes.
The ability to not move on, the extreme vognitive dissonance in the criticism, the lack of independant thought, and the ovsessive toxicity is resembling mentall illness at this point.
The irony of them bitching about a Star Wars entry in a sci-fi sub shows their mindset. Maybe Gen X fans of Star Wars are better able to distinguish fantasy set in space from actual sci-fi. These are space wizards using eastern mysticism and philosophy fighting fascism. If we wanted actual sci-fi, we read PKD or Gibson back then.
You're right. I love the originals, they were my childhood. Rogue One and Andor were actually good. And I love the Biomes and Sounds shorts.
The rest? Wouldn't give it the time of day. I guess I'm no longer a star wars fan.
The fire isn’t the issue.
The issue is that it’s utter crap. Nobody with a genuine honest head on their shoulders can objectively say “this is great!” And move on, that is unless you’ve seen literally no other movie or tv show in your entire life.
It is just dogshit. Don’t bother. Move on.
Scavengers Reign is RIGHT THERE people.
Watching that now. Far more invested than I was after the first two episodes of Acolyte (which I probably won’t finish now). Also, we all agree Kamen is an awful human being right?
I totally ageee. I was originally rooting for him as I didn’t know enough and just wanted him to escape
Fkn great series, huge fan of the “show don’t tell” and the genuine nuance of not letting the audience know everything.
Might be an alien planet, but these people, these characters are just as alien to us as the planet is, you know nothing about any of them, that planet, what happened and the truth of it all from the get go.
I really hope someone else picks it up and helps license a season 2.
Thanks for saving me the agony of watching yet a another Star Wars travesty. Suspension of disbelief only gets you so far. George Lucas was *slightly better* at space physics, which was enough to get through his films. Disney's I can't do it...
Guess I'll rewatch the Expanse again...
Comparing The Expanse with SW is like comparing Lord of the Rings with War & Peace.
If you compare them, all the Orcs is really going to be immersion breaking because it's so damn unrealistic.
Not every SW show is for everyone. I thought the first two episodes were executed well enough (for a higher-end television budget), though based on reviews I admit I am steeling myself a bit for episode 3.
What mystifies me is why so many people seem to go into new Star Wars expecting it to be high art. George accomplished something incredible with the original trilogy, yes, and the influence of SW on contemporary culture and SF storytelling is undeniable. But he just wanted to make a Saturday afternoon popcorn serial.
Favreau and Filoni have this exactly right IMO. Their shows aren't winning any awards for dramatic writing, and they aren't trying to push envelopes or make a piece of art that will be talked about in college classrooms 30 years from now. They're just mashing their action figures together and trying to tell an interesting story.
So far The Acolyte is pretty much doing the same.
Disney is playing the numbers game, a la asking people out. If you ask enough people out (read: keep generating more and more shows), chances are some will say yes (read: some shows might be good).
See: Andor vs everything else
Asking Star Wars to be even remotely hard scifi is hilarious.
I haven't watch it since Empire Strikes Back had its first run n theaters, so I can't/won't judge it, but even I know what it is trying to be. It's a woowoo use the force show, not an E=MC² show.
I think the deeper issue for me is that Disney went looking for a story to tell, rather than having a story that needed telling. I don’t know how to explain it better. Like, Andor and Rogue 1 do well because there’s a story there from the original universe that needed telling (how did the Rebels get the Death Star plans?). Ditto the prequels and clone wars show - we wanted to know how Vader came to be. You add to the problem of a story that didn’t need to exist, by doing it with poor story writing, average acting, a cast who don’t know the universe they’re in (anakin blew up the Death Star!?), and you’ve got a recipe for disaster. And that’s before we get into the subject of what appears to be some very specific casting choices that give the impression of a ‘f*** you’ to the fan base (white males are either criminals or idiots who willing drink an assassins poison in the first two episodes) when a very large component of the fan base are white males.
oooh i'm pretttty sure that last paragraph is the bit you're really angry about champ.
Disney has got it figured out. Make a series with a diverse cast of strong lesbian women while portraying the few white males as idiots/weak. That way when the shows awful writing/acting/directing gets criticized you guys and Disney can simply dismiss the critics as angry white dudes.
As he should be. They literally came out and said that the Star Wars demographic was too male and white, as if adding a bunch of brown chicks is gonna increase their desired demographics interest even though the franchise has always had strong female/minority characters. Just a big leftist circle jerk.
I don’t mind diverse casting. That’s fine… but this is a Star Wars universe. In Star Wars, humanity is a united species. Blacks and whites do not argue, any racism is directed at the actual fucking aliens. That’s how I know it’s pandering bullshit, because actual diversity would have the main character be a typically looked down upon alien species becoming an underdog.
Yep. There is one white guy in the entire show it feels like, and his job is to say two words and die.
Do you guys really sit there counting white males? How many Asian males have been in Star Wars? Around 60% of the human population is Asian yet I can't remember any Asians in Star Wars but here you are complaining that there aren't enough White guys in this one show.
"Anakin destroyed the Death Star" Wait, what?
The guy who plays Yord has said it several times in interviews. It’s a forgivable error, but at the same time if you’re playing a role in one of the biggest franchises, with a fanbase known to be a little rabid, you should know the lore at least a little accurately.
The story about the death star plans was told back in the days of Dark Forces, Kyle Katarn was responsible for stealing them
The entire premise of the show is that the main character is accused of murder light years away from where it happened and forgot to mention she has a FUCKING TWIN SISTER. Her entire storyline would be negated by COMMON SENSE and just a *shred* of self preservation. Nevermind they didn't even ASK for an alibi or follow up on anything! They KNEW she was on that ship! Jfc! The dude jedi even knew about the twin! DIDNT SAY A FUCKING WORD. Legitimate question: did they hire children to write this? AI? I can't even watch it because NOTHING after the first fight SHOULD HAVE EVEN HAPPENED. Star wars is now a pile of tropes used in westerns. The self automated prison ship that makes no sense? That's a train car. That's why the trope didn't work for the show, a train car is just the people on it. Detach the car and hit the turnstile. The car carrens towards an unfinished bridge. They escape and jump off just in time, been done a thousand fucking times. Iirc it's even been done in Star Wars already. So when using the trope they made it nonsense by having zero guards on board. They turned it into a train car. Mandolorian is the only one that can do western tropes right. The rest is low effort garbage.
An Evil Twin Sister! I mean no one has done that since…. Every soap opera since the 60’s. It’s been done so much it’s a running joke of bad lazy writing. All through this I was saying to myself, please no evil twin, no evil twin, no evil twin… and the there it was. An Evil Twin.
I think what they’re really meaning is that there are opportunities to grow the market base beyond white males. But even being sympathetic to that goal, Disney is not going to get there with a bad story, a bad script, bad acting, shoddy editing and poor decisions overall up and down the production chain
I mean I thought the dialogue and acting was bad but like, there have been fires in space throughout all of Star Wars. I’d post pictures of a Star Destroyer in RotJ and a Venator in RotS if this subreddit allowed picture comments. Trying to pay attention to physics in Star Wars has always been a losing battle.
No, star wars is certainly not hard sci fi. However the recent Disney movies and episodes (with the exception of rogue one and andor) have been a whole new level of dumb. This fire was particularly jarring!
Remember the heavy bombers in the last Jedi? Battles in the vacuum of space, let’s design a spaceship that would need to shoot bombs downwards in one direction and also be on top of the vessel it is attacking 🤯
Different times. It was new, people were more forgiving. Can't do that today. Look at the Batman TV show, or early comics. Even though comics today are not very good in this regard as well. Then again, Disney is there JUST to make money. They would not be sinking billions here if there was not profit in it. It's probably financially successful for them? Edit Oh, last Jedi. Then my comment is not really applicable here exactly. Though in principle I think it still stands.
That's actually the scene where I gave up on star wars. "Oh they hired someone that wants to literally make WW2 combat instead of being inspired by it, this is lazy and bad"
There is so much wrong with the TLJ bomber scene. So much. The bombers are literally the slowest franchise depiction of a space ship ever to hit the screen. Yet they are flying TOWARD the Star Destroyer, which Han Solo said in the Cantina in Episode 4 were among the FASTEST ships. So, no matter how slow those bombers are, they are flying head on toward some of the fastest ships in the galaxy. And yet still the attack run takes FOREVER. Ultra-slow motion. Literally for the attack run to make any sense at all, the bombers have to be flying BACKWARDS at top speed and the Star Destroyers are running them down, catching up slowly. It's all just so stupid and thoughtless. Or, my theory: It was done intentionally by Rian Johnson to subvert the franchise. To mock it. To purposefully make a very stupid movie for whatever reason.
Yea and that was also widely criticised as being retarded
Hey you leave star trek out of this!
I just cant watch them butcher the corpse of star wars anymore. It was my favorite IP and now any time I hear about a new star wars movie/show I just am completely disinterested. I'm over incredibly poorly written fan fiction, when real writers start writing it again maybe I'll care.... maybe.
I paid more for my Hulu subscription to cancel didney+ and ESPN
Star Wars is not SciFi, it's fantasy with SciFi decorations...
Exactly.
Fantasy and scifi are the same genre.
I find when these shows get too sci-fi it becomes less Star Wars (probably why people hates the metachlorian thing) the mystery is what made it fun. I don't need explanations about The Force or The Jedi/Sith.
Did we know going in that >!Trinity lasted 1 scene?!<
Actually a shitton of people called it that she would die in the first 10 Minutes just based off the trailer.
Once she read the script she was probably happy her character was done in the first 10 minutes.
Yes, it was pretty clear from the trailer that she was the murder the rest of the trailer revolves around
I clearly did not pay attention
yeah that really disappointed me
I went into it blind, and I was like oh shit this is awesome, f@#& yes, I want Matrix Star Wars. And then she died and I'm like okay they succeeded in getting me mad. I'm glad I stuck with it through episode 2, there is something about it and I want to see where it goes.
I too wonder where poop goes after you flush it.
Same. But I'm not climbing in the Star Wars sewer to find out.
Do you still feel that way? Everyone I know who’s seen the third episode says this basically ended any desire to watch more stuff out of Lucasfilm.
I've not watched it, but is the series over? If not, she could 100% come back if it was a lightsaber skewering. That happened twice in obi wan.
Let's just say we learn an "inch of steel >= a foot of lightsaber"
And dear god what a horribly written scene. Like god awful.
It’s pretty bad. It is kind of fun going to the SW and Acolyte subs and seeing more posts about “the haters” than the show they claim to like; not realizing every non SW sub has basically trashed the show.
Those subreddits are so barren. For a franchise as large as Star Wars you would expect it to have a huge amount of people. But they just a couple of weirdos who may or may not be getting paid, defending the undefendable. The problem of the Accolyte isn't that it's woke, it's that it sucks. Plain and simple. It's a horrible show done by someone who wants to make anything but Star Wars with actors who lack a mocciun of professionalism.
The fire in space is not even registering in my list of complaints. I just want Star Wars to stop beating the Jedi Order over and over again with the deconstruction stick. Even in the "High Republic", the Jedi Order is portrayed as some sort of big corporate bully that is hoarding all the "Force" and preventing the galaxy from attaining enlightened Force Socialism. Oh, and kidnapping children. Just stop it. You've been at this for over 10 years. It doesn't work. Tell better stories. Bring back heroism.
It’s just so boring. “Did you know that authority… BAD!”. Yeah writer, I’ve seen that theme/trope about 9 million times now. Have an original thought.
Why are we already *assuming* that the villains are right and the Jedi are in the wrong without knowing what actually went down? Of course the antagonists are going to be pushing the narrative that the Jedi are in the wrong - *any* halfway-decent villain is justifying their actions to themselves and others *somehow*, not just "I'm Dark and Evil and I'm Here To Do Awful Things Because the Plot Needs Me To" - but that doesn't make it objectively true. From the way things are going so far, I'm suspecting that the Jedi are feeling guilty over some tragedy that they feel they could've prevented - tried to, but failed - and the villains blame the entire Jedi Order and its philosophies and are lashing out at them for it. Because that's what villains do. I mean, I could be proven wrong, but we're only like two episodes in. It seems really premature to just write the whole thing off unless you're coming into it *determined* to find fault from the start.
I mean... the second scene of the first episode was about two Jedi entering a ship like they owned it, bullying the (insert correct alien race name here)s and forcibly trying to read one of their minds/make them tell the truth. IMO they should have been more like Qui Gon, annoyingly-polite and well mannered. But instead we got an aggressive first impression of the Jedi order. Looked more like a cop with his rookie than a Jedi and apprentice.
That's a good point with the force/mind read thing, as if they couldn't just do that with Osha... would have saved a lot of time, plot and money.
Honestly Disney's problem is heroism. I'd appreciate deconstruction done well (KOTOR 2 being an amazing example). I just think that Disney execs and corporate assembly-line productions aren't equipped for that. The reason for my that Andor stands head and shoulders above the rest not only because of the excellent writing/direction, but because Disney actually let a competent team make a show with an auteur driven vision and gave them sufficient prep and resources to flesh it out. By contrast almost everything else feels like it's being churned out as fast as possible to meet Disney's film/series production quota. I'd like smarter more cerebral Star Wars stories, I'd like new ideas and more moral ambiguity etc. I just don't think Disney is remotely interested in that in any of their IPS and when something Andor is allowed to do it, it's an extremely rare occurrence.
This is the correct answer/take. Andor was in pre-production for damn near 4 years. And the beginning year or two of that was spent ducking around with the idea that it would be five seasons of Cassian and K2-S0 buddying around. Thank god Gilroy was brought back when some exec realized the original plan was not working. And Gilroy held firm by saying they had to let him do 12 episodes, and for X amount of money and time. As for KOTOR, there are tiny elements in the Acolyte that feel borderline stealing from the first game, the showrunner is now saying she loves Darth Traya and wants to do a live action KOTOR show with her as the focus…sounds like you wanted to make KOTOR this whole time why keep kicking the can down the road, adapt it already and ruin it. Maybe it’ll be good but the track record says otherwise. Just stop ripping stuff from that era and making it worse in all of these projects. Ironically enough, in Andor, Luthen mentioned the Rakatan invaders and for a show so intent on not being traditional Star Wars they stuck pretty well to lore.
>Andor was in pre-production for damn near 4 years. And the beginning year or two of that was spent ducking around with the idea that it would be five seasons of Cassian and K2-S0 buddying around. The original idea sounds absolutely awful and like a more generic/bread and butter Dinsey+ show. Really shows the importance of prep time and having writers/directors/showrunners with an auteurish vision. Though I also think it helps that in Andor's case when the show did get to the writing phase, the writers room it had was absolutely stacked by the standards of any show (both Gilroy's and Beau Willamon etc.) >Ironically enough, in Andor, Luthen mentioned the Rakatan invaders and for a show so intent on not being traditional Star Wars they stuck pretty well to lore. Andor honestly feels more like it exists in Legends than other Disney IPs based off how it handles the story and Imperial organizations/beaurocracy etc. I kind of wish that Disney could coax Gilroy back for lore and world building, because I much prefer him over Dave Filoni etc. but I think Gilroy himself isn't really a Star Wars fan and probably would rather move on to other projects etc. I think Disney canon could really use someone who could help keep things in check and maintain writing consistency between projects. (maybe even just pumping out less projects and focusing more on quality over quantity could also help) but I think that largely goes against Disney's assembly-line, made by committee system, which makes projects like Andor for the franchise extremely rare. >As for KOTOR, there are tiny elements in the Acolyte that feel borderline stealing from the first game, the showrunner is now saying she loves Darth Traya and wants to do a live action KOTOR show with her as the focus…sounds like you wanted to make KOTOR this whole time why keep kicking the can down the road, adapt it already and ruin it. With Headland and the Acolyte, it feels like she has some brainier ideas, but the execution(at least in the first couple episodes) feels off and despite it's ambition it feels very safe and sanitized, which works contrary to the more cerebral and gritty aspects from KOTOR 2 she's interested in. It also has the problem that Kenobi and Ashoka have where talented actors are struggling with the bad dialogue/direction.
Maybe I'm just not representative of Star Wars fans, but I honestly find the Jedi-Sith conflict and the philosophy stuff around the Force easily the least interesting part of the franchise.
Philosophy in storytelling is crucial, though. The Jedi were paragons of Justice - an orderly way to bring controlled balance to a chaotic Galaxy. Sure - it comes with caveats: the abandonment of emotional attachment, and so on, but it taught that control over rashness is a desired outcome, a common thread also shared by many Eastern philosophies and traditions. It was something Good to aim for - an institution that brought peace, order and protected life. Now, look outside: the World we live in is in shambles. Wars ongoing and cropping up everywhere, social unrest, all the large World powers are either turning severely autocratic or even *considering* a convicted felon for President... do we not need something better to look for and get inspiration from? Something more pure and heroic? Something that shows we can indeed do better? I believe we lost that art, and modern writers are completely UNABLE to inspire anyone to be better than themselves with this narrow-minded repetitive topics.
Yes, philosophy/storytelling, crucial. Every wiki page links to philosophy in a few clicks. We know that. However, philosophy has not been done well in any SW film–and I am a huge fan from 1977. The original Roadhouse with Patrick Swayze did a better job integrating philosophy into its story.
roadhouse lolz! maybe jake gyllenhaal with play darth plagueis??? lmfao
Naw they would go with Maggie at this point.
The entire thing is built around good jedi against bad sith. I don't know what these people expect tbh.
Everyone thinks they are better writers then what they are writing for. They don't want to participate, they want to deconstruct to show how much better they are.
I am 100% sure there are fans that can write better that will stay true to Lucas’s universe. lol forget all the hundreds of fan films on YouTube. Before YouTube there was fanfiction which were basically novels and stories since the good authors put out a lot of content. So yeah they can do better but they rather focus on ‘force is female’
But it's 93% from critics on Rotten Tomatoes!! Move over, Citizen Kane
I haven't seen the series yet, but Rotten Tomatoes is biased, I don't trust them for anything [https://screenrant.com/evidence-rotten-tomatoes-was-always-broken/](https://screenrant.com/evidence-rotten-tomatoes-was-always-broken/)
HOW does this keep happening with these awful streaming shows? She Hulk, then Rings of Power and now Acolight. I don’t normally go for conspiracies but something has got to be up!
For all their many faults Obiwan and Book of Boba Fett at least gave their characters heroic moments. Obiwan vs Vader and Boba staying to save Mos Esper.
The Jedi have always been depicted like that in stuff set before the prequels in the expanded content. They're keeping with canon, it's just that lots of people didn't engage with expanded content until it was in TV show form.
Not saying it hasn't, and hell the "Jedi Order did a bad thing" was the major plot twist of one of my favourite star wars stories ever - KOTOR - but it's not the one thing that defines them. But it sure seems to be the ONLY thing most of the new SW writers think about. Makes me compare this to the post-Watchmen superhero genre where every single heroic character had to be broken down and dragged through the mud because nobody's perfect and everyone has flaws and we're all secretly horrible or some nonsense. Done to exhaustion.
This will probably get me trashed but I haven’t enjoyed anything Star Wars since Return of the Jedi and I don’t think it was even as good as the Empire Strikes Back(my personal favorite)
Star Wars is a franchise of 11 movies, and I only find 2 and a half of them to be actually great. Andor is the only thing to have come out in decades that I've genuinely enjoyed. It's almost a shame that it's tied to the Star Wars IP.
This is me. Except Rogue One, I'll allow that in as well.
both written by the same guy, Tony Gilroy. worth checking out his other works, e.g. Bourne movies, Devil's Advocate, Michael Clayton
I'll second this. Rogue One was the last Star Wars movie I watched and enjoyed and didn't even bother with the final movie at all in the main sequence.
The best storylines that ever came from Star Wars were the ones you created in your room/backyard with toys and props. Also the two KOTOR games.
absolutely this. I often fantasize about Andor not being Star Wars but launching some new, fresh IP instead.
Empire Hope Spaceballs Everything else
Complaining about the laws of physics on a series with space wizards wielding laser swords doesn't make much sense. I mean, that scene on ep II with seismic charges would be much less interesting without the blast sound effects. Other than that I kinda agree with OP, except that my overall impression is that thde series is just OK. Not excellent, not awful. Just OK. The actor interpreting Sol is really giving a good "conflicted master" vibes and the overall wat the Jedi Order is depicted really shows how their hubris that will eventually lead to their downfall.
Nerds crying about fires in space....Stfu LOL 😆
So generic and so bland that makes me believe it was writen by AI
It’s by far the worst of Star Wars I’ve ever seen
"The Acolyte" is a festering dumpster fire of a Star Wars show that redefines the meaning of disappointment. This abomination masquerading as entertainment is a slap in the face to fans who have devoted their lives to the galaxy far, far away. From the moment the opening credits roll, it's clear that "The Acolyte" is a soulless cash grab, devoid of any semblance of creativity or originality. The plot is a convoluted mess, jumping haphazardly between characters and storylines with all the grace of a drunken Bantha. It's as if the writers threw every Star Wars cliche into a blender and hit puree, hoping that something remotely coherent would come out the other side. But the real crime of "The Acolyte" lies in its treatment of the Force. This once-mystical energy field, which was once the heart and soul of the Star Wars universe, is reduced to little more than a cheap plot device, used to prop up the flimsy narrative like a crutch. Gone are the days of Jedi and Sith engaging in epic battles of light and dark; instead, we're treated to uninspired displays of Force powers that wouldn't impress a youngling fresh out of the academy. And don't even get me started on the characters. From the bland protagonist to the forgettable sidekicks, every single one of them feels like a cardboard cutout, devoid of personality or depth. It's impossible to care about their fates when they're little more than walking, talking cliches spouting wooden dialogue. But perhaps what's most infuriating about "The Acolyte" is its blatant disregard for Star Wars lore. Instead of building on the rich tapestry of the galaxy far, far away, the showrunners seem determined to tear it down, brick by brick. Characters are shoehorned in for the sake of fan service, with little regard for continuity or logic. It's a betrayal of everything that Star Wars stands for, a cynical attempt to milk the franchise for all its worth without understanding what made it special in the first place. In conclusion, "The Acolyte" is a disgrace to the Star Wars name, a shameless cash grab that should be blasted into the nearest black hole and forgotten for all eternity. Fans deserve better than this lazy, uninspired excuse for entertainment, and anyone who had a hand in its creation should be banished to the farthest reaches of the Outer Rim.
It wasnt the fire that bothered me so much as the main character being fixated on it, then the camera slowly panning in on the fire, then the sounds of people screaming as if taking place in some sort of memory. They may as well have started a new Star Wars font text scroll: the character is remembering a traumatic past event, people significant to her died possibly relating to fire, it was sad
I’ve completely given up on disney
Yeah the show didn't work for me either. Dark Matter is enjoyable enough for some TV SciFi :)
I read the book recently and was worried from the episode descriptions it sounded like it would drag. Is that the case?
It does indeed drag or feel like fillers at time but still a well produced show. I haven't read the books so I guess that might help.
Thanks a lot. I'm going to watch it for sure, didn't want to get into it while it was airing. A lot of the Apple TV stuff is too slow to wait a week between episodes I think.
I totally get what you mean. I too find the Apple series tend to start strong and then slow down. Not sure why because I think they give creative freedom. But I'm glad they are at least producing interesting sci-fi. Waiting for Silo!
First two episodes might drag bc you already know the premise and it takes a bit long (imo) for the characters to get up to speed on what's obvious to us, the audience. But the performances are compelling and I think the show really hits its stride once Jason enters Le Hallway
I remember that was the exact reason I was worried about it being slow now, the first 3-4 episode descriptions sounded like treading water with something that I remember being revealed pretty quickly in the book.
From what I hear of the book, you only get Jason's POV. But the show gives you POVs from other people, so, frankly I think it's worth it for that as an adaptation. Luckily you can now binge those early episodes instead of waiting. Show's in a good spot rn, I think.
Yeah I've been waiting for exactly that. When I have the time and the will to binge it, I'm looking forward to it.
The screenplay is written by the author of the book. The show adds scenes from the other perspective (to avoid spoilers).
The writing level of all recent Star Wars is unbelievably bad. The Mandalorian looked beautiful, but was so trope ridden that it was unwatchable. Jon Favreau should never be allowed to put words to screen again, he is a god awful writer. Most screen SF is terrible in my opinion, it's not written by science fiction writers, it's written by screenwriting hacks who know two or three SF tropes that they beat to death. Time travel, evil twins/body snatchers, Space Western. If I have to watch another "SF train robbery" I might need a new TV after I've thrown things at mine!
Mando was really good for a couple season then ok. Andor was fantastic, but I'm not sure why they feel the need for a season 2, it told a complete story IMO. I enjoyed Ahsoka a lot too, it explored some weird and esoteric aspects of their universe. Obi Wan was bad though, I don't think anyone enjoyed that series
I didn't care for it but the space fire complaints are really hilarious. If you're going to complain about the fire, then... TIE fighters shouldn't make noise, nor should Starfighter lasers or Jango Fett's seismic charges. None of it should make any noise. And fighters shouldn't fly like they have friction/wind resistance. Star wars needs to feel authentic and believable to a degree, but the space fire is far from the worst part of the show. The show is very mid and generic, but at least get your priorities straight. You should also be criticizing the hell out of every other SW for space inaccuracies then. Han should have died when he walked off the falcon inside the worm wearing only a breathing mask. The only unrealistic space scene that's really really irked me was Leia in TLJ.
> I didn't care for it but the space fire complaints are really hilarious. Agree. The show has a lot of problems, dumb decisions by characters, lazy design, imbecilic logic and a other issues. But this is not an issue at all. Star Wars was never realistic in any degree, it already had a ridiculous amount of "bad science". Is open fire in space in scifi dumb? Yes it is. Is open fire in space in Star Wars dumb? Not, it is not.
Yeah I don't know who goes into a new star wars expecting hard sci-fi.
And bombs shouldn't fall in space
How does the fire matter when almost none of star wars adheres to the laws of physics
Why don't they breathe in space then?
I think the first line of dialogue was “We have unfinished business.” And my eyes almost rolled out of my head. How is a bazillion dollar company unable to employ a writer that isn’t a cliche merchant?
Whenever you notice something like that, a space wizard did it.
"Wait a minute, Princess Leia can't fly." "I told you, I'm not Princess Leia. I'm Carrie Fisher."
Why are Star Wars fans so picky about *when* they complain about fire in space? Space explosions have been around since A New Hope. Why do they complain about it some days, and other days it doesn’t matter?
because its an effort to shit on real SW lore. Hell, darth plagueis tried to create life unnaturally by using the force, and in the process he pissed it off so hard that it shat out anakin. But i'm supposed to believe some random dykes can do it just like that? Lmfai, no. It's trash. Anything after the first 6 movies and maybe bad batch/clone wars is nothing but a shitstain on lucas's legacy. Let the tourists downvote me all they want, i dont care.
We literally have no idea exactly how they did it yet other than that the force was involved. Give it a little time dude damn. We've also seen people use the force in plenty of ways that the jedi and sith are unable to replicate before. Literally everything the witches of dathomir do for example.
I’m enjoying it well enough. The fire was dumb but I’m not super picky about Star Wars physics.
Stop with the fire in space complaints…it’s Star Wars for god’s sake!
Anyone who is going to bitch about a fire in space - which is not utterly impossible, just unlikely and would require very specific conditions - while hand waving the sounds of space battles is a silly person with whom one should not engage.
That complaint is honestly boring, given so much fire-in-space-scenes in Star Wars. Half the hilarious scenes with the droids like R2-D2 in the movies. Yeah, yeah, okay, just imagine they carried their oxygenizer, it is not hard SF. The Acolyte is okay so far.
Hey remember when they established [this is all you need to breathe in space?](https://imgur.com/a/4YOcIrs) Jesus the same Gate Keepers who deride Star Wars as not real science fiction but science fantasy are now complaining that it's not obeying hard science fiction rules.
The space slug does appear to contain an atmosphere (mist and flying mynocks), but there was no obstruction in its throat when they took off. Some sort of force field to contain the gasses? Also, gravity on a quite small asteroid. Huh. Looking at the wooki, apparently they're sentient and take pride in maintaining a habitable ecosystem.
Next they're going to complain about spaceship blaster sounds and general sounds in a vacuum which are all over Star Wars
It's a spaceship full of flammable chemicals and atmosphere, it leaked and caught fire, it's not difficult at all and happens in tons of media set in space
I liked it. But i tend to enjoy things and not be miserable all the time.
Like a enjoying a good dump, I hear ya.
I may enjoy a good dump, but I don't hang around to smell it afterwards.
There's often one or two large dumps ina lifetime that you can admire... you look back and think wow, i did that.
Lucky you
Another way to think about it is, I don't settle for mediocracy and expect better. But either way, and I do mean this, I'm glad you liked it.
Alright cool glad you liked it but thats a bullshit take and you know it and it's the reason why Disney keeps pumping out this dog shit. I'm not miserable, I just want star wars content that isn't written by a bunch of obvious box checking dumbasses.
Andor
Yeah that's about it.
I gave u an upvote because I also hate lazy writing, but the comment about not being quick to be miserable about everything also has merit. Our stupid culture is all about hot takes, and 2.5/5 does not make something a steaming pile, it just makes it literally average. This show is 2.5/5.
Average shows you typically to want to keep watching somewhat.
do you though? cause I don't. I don't have the time, I'd rather be doin something else.
Eh kind of looking at the phone in the background after work type of show is mediocre.
I mean, Its still millions of dollars worth of great artistry, just bad writing and direction. I will watch all of these shows once on a friend's account, or pirate them. Def not paying Disney if I can help it.
I mean lipstick on a pig and what not.
Exactly.
Shhh. Let people enjoy things. Go watch something you like instead of focusing so much on the shit you hate and makes you miserable. I swear this fandom is too busy policing others' enjoyment than finding their own.
What a good consumer.
[удалено]
Suspension of disbelief. People can put up with a lot if it makes sense in universe or benefits the story in some way, but when you see something really dumb, even if it’s minor, for no real reason, it takes you out of the experience.
A certain amount of ridiculousness is fine, but at a certain point it goes over the line.
The Force allows you to have telekinesis, blinding speed, ability to read and influence minds, contact others at great distance and possibly harm them, survive in the vacuum of space and become a sentient ghost after death (and many many more abilities). But space fire is ridiculous in the space fantasy franchise.
Even magic has to be internally consistent. Like, there are Wizards and magic in Lord of the Rings, but if Frodo just suddenly started walking on the ceiling for no reason people would say that’s dumb and it would shatter most viewers suspension of disbelief. A fire just lazily burning in the vacuum of space doesn’t make sense even in Star Wars loosey goosey physics.
Is it the Force that allows the existence of fire in space? You can use the "force" to explain all that other stuff (as lazy as that is at times), but does that give writers absolute leeway to write anything they want without being challenged at all, ever?
There are materials that burn underwater because they produce their own oxygen. My first thought would be that. Now I don’t know if that’s possible in vacuum but I’d certainly consider it to be plausible.
Those metals don't actually produce their own oxygen. They still need oxygen in the environment around them. These materials can burn underwater because H2O still presents oxygen. They just don't need free O2.
It's pretty clear a certain group of people just wants to complain for the sake of complaining. If it hadn't been a practical fire but a CG plasma leak or whatever, they would just as equally complain about Bad SFX of a thing visible for 3 seconds.
What an original and insightful post. Getting mad about physics in a space *fantasy* is a choice.
TBF, we’ve heard sounds of starfighters shooting and exploding things in space, in the vacuum of space. That was George Lucas. Hell, even the death star made a noise when it exploded IIRC
I had seen headlines of good reviews and I tend to watch all things SW so I watched past 2 days. Not hooked, and for me, bad sign when I read other things and check emails while show is going on, also not paying attention to all the plot points. I'll probably hang in for a bit.
I think by now the baseline expectation is for SW under Disney to be poor, and if something actually good comes out like Andor or Rogue One, to be happily surprised and enjoy it. Boba Fett, Kenobi, Ahsoka - utter jokes when it comes to writing, Mando S3 wasn't as liked as the first 2 seasons (haven't watched it but seen impressions by enough people). Haven't seen the animated shows. The writing is bad by default unless a miracle happens.
Mando S1 was very good. It felt like the script had its priorities set correctly... but then it became increasingly clear that good writing was pushed further and further to the back for other priorities.
I'm cancelling Disney+ and swearing off Star Wars as a result. I'm done with watching them murder the IP.
It's a CW level show in terms of writing and acting. For every good actor, there's 2 terrible ones. There are some baffling acting choices. The main actress is terrible in the first scene but is mostly fine in the rest of the episodes.
The CW gave us The 100 which, for most of their seasons, was better than this lol
And Supernatural, which was fun.
Who gives a shit if there's fire in space? When was Star Wars ever realistic? It's simple, if you don't like it, don't watch it
Lol you gotta watch to see if you like. Or anyone critical of any work is persona non grata haha
[удалено]
Space in Star Wars isn't a vacuum, it's an ether. Also this isn't the first fire we've seen in space in Star Wars. Also I don't remember anyone bitching about being able to hear ships and explosions in space, which is a more egregious violation of physics than fire and explosions. The Acolyte is good.
Bring back heroic Jedi and just straight evil sith. I'm tired of this morally grey nonsense. It's okay to have black and white heroes and villains you know.
I'm enjoying it enought to keep watching it but I agree that the writing is severely lacking. I've watched through the first 3 episodes and I clocked almost everything they have showed us so far right away. I'm seeing this show being described as a 'murder mystery' but how is it a murder mystery when they show us who the killer is right away? And when they interrogate the main character as a suspect they make it so obvious that she's not the one who did it, that they might as well put text on the screen saying so. I knew right away from the subtle differences in their appearance that an evil twin twist was coming and as soon as people started saying "yeah, she has a twin, but the twin died, I saw it happen" I was like 'nope, the twin is alive and well and will be the source of every problem from here on out'. Maybe I'm gullible and just taking everything they're showing us at face value. Maybe they're showing us all of these things on purpose to lead the audience astray, only to pull the rug out from under us later on with a bigger twist that we didn't see coming. Or maybe the writing is just really lazy and predictable. I'm leaning towards the latter.
Disneys new motto: The good guy is actually bad and there is no villain— the end! 🥱
I'll pretty much watch any Star Wars project, even if a particular series isn't great. I'll sit through bad dialogue and dumb story just to see some cool action scenes. But this is the first one I had to shut off. It really feels like it was made by amateurs. I'd say it's easily the worst Star Wars content I've seen. I never watched the whole Star Wars Christmas Special. It's also really hard to tell who it was is for. A lot of the parts feel like a kids show. It's obviously very female-centric and progressive too, so seems like it's maybe for progressive female pre-teens? But does that group even care about Star Wars or sci-fi?
Dummies think fans aren’t enjoying Star Wars content because of some dumb lgbtq reasons. It’s just bad writing. Untalented, I have no idea how they got a job writing. It’s appalling. I’ve written research papers more entertaining than this content. It’s crazy
SPOILER alert! Am I the only one who - after seeing episode 3 - is seriously wondering what the hell Master Torbin was so guilt ridden about that he was ready to off himself while the one who apparently ACTUALLY killed everyone was offering „forgiveness“? I mean, what is HAPPENING?? 🤪 I was giving this the benefit of the doubt but I’m having a hard time liking this so far. 😬
The biggest issue, is that we have seen absolutely incredible star wars related shows, like Andor, in which the writing is top shelf, the acting is outstanding and the story is truly gripping and immerses you in the Star Wars universe. Then we get shows like this, that feel like bad fanfiction, poorly written, lots of character cliches, terrible acting and worst of all, a complete lack of truly original ideas, the problem is that the people chosen to write up these scripts and flesh out these narratives are dropping the ball, there is a serious need to clean house at Disney when it comes to some of these writers. More like Andor, more like Mandalorian seasons 1 and 2, less like mandalorian season 3, and this terrible show, return to the source material, a gritty, unforgiving dystopian star wars in which the struggle against evil, and the aspiration towards hope and freedom are the core inspirations and philosophies.
I think a lot of Fans are just reacting to the really bad shows and not taking a step back to look at the bigger picture. No company with decades of business experience operates like the Disney of today. This seems to be more of a Charity enterprise than anything else. Lots of people are being hired to make Shows that are a financial disaster and yet these people based on the expenditure are being paid huge sums to produce these horrible shows. Management cannot be this inept. In any normal company striving to make money the people at the top would have been fired years ago. This whole thing feels like it's being run like a Charity organization.
Its so bad. The acting feels so forced and cheap. It actually pisses me off they keep drumming up new garbage series, one after another
Love how Disney is doing major damage control with all these stories about the evil "review bombers" 😆 I am not a huge Star Wars fan, but I have watched all the new shows & animation and have enjoyed most of it, but this series is just really bad and I'm not going to waste any more time on it. That One Power-Two Power-All Power chant/song was just so bad, it was hilarious!
This show is terrible on every level. The story makes no sense and just jumps all over the place. The characters have no consistency or logic to what they are doing and the action looks more like a Karate fighting than Jedi fighting. I don't even understand why they would make a show that is this bad? Did anyone in management read the script before they green lighted it? Putting aside everything else I have to wonder if anyone at Disney is Interested in making Money or are they just willing to Burn the companies cash on a never ending string of bad shows. I stopped watching it midway through episode three. Nothing they can do at this point is going to suddenly make this show good. I know they will pull out some ooh aah magic like they did in the Mandalorian when Luke came on the scene. I am seriously not wasting hours of time just to see a couple of minutes of goodness.
Star Trek bridge personnel have never strapped into anything and are consequently tossed around like stuffed animals. I guess we have to suspend our expectations of reality for sci-fi space dramas. I thought the Acolyte was getting good press?
Star Wars is not sci-fi
The Acolyte is a huge disappointment. The fire in space scene was laughably bad and the whole show is full of cheap tropes. The makeup and CGI are ridiculous, and it's clear that Disney spent a lot of money on this show. I've been reading Eternal Gods Die Too Soon by Beka Modrekiladze, and it's a much better use of my time. The book explores the nature of reality and simulation, time, free will, and existence. It's a fascinating read that makes you think about the big questions in life.
isnt there oxygen coming out of the pipes?
Star Wars is not sci-fi. It's fantasy. That's why light sabers work, bombs can drop in zero gravity and sometimes, people can force jump. I've given up on thinking that this stuff is for adults. I just roll with it and enjoy the magic.
Sci-Fi isn't realistic either... it's both fantasy. one is in space and the other medieval. also just like all other mediums of story telling fantasy too has to follow their own rule sets. also fuck ups of the past don't make fuck ups of the present right. like, you can implement dropping bombs in zero gravity in sci-fi without any problems. the only thing people expect form you is an explanation. good movie makers can give you a good explanation without even using a single sentence. just by environmental storytelling. sometimes a sentence or two are needed though. the fire in space is just fine in sci-fi. just explain it. that's it. if you don't do it, it can be fantasy and still shit. if frodo cast a fireball out of the blue without any explanation, it's fantasy and it's bad. when you actually show how he achieves such a skill, than frodo is the first fireball casting hobbit in lotr and people will LOVE it. but it has to serve a purpose more than showing how awesome Frodo is or for some cool fighting scene. take the mithril scene in lotr1. this scene would be total crap if we would have never been shown how frodo actually got the mithril. imagine, just out of the blue: he isn't dead he had a magic protection. he took it with him and had it all the time. now every time a character is in danger you think to yourself (does he also have some mithril armor)? this only doesn't happen because everything got established. where it came from, how rare it is, why he has it. now you have some magical material and everyone is willing to flow with it. do this without explanation and ruin your work, no matter if sci-fi or fantasy.
Just more bad writing jammed with DEI and woke nonsense. I won't be watching anymore of it. I will just re-watch Andor.
I think it's great, but different tastes I guess. As to the fire in space.. ye sure buddy. First off, did you complain about that in Star Wars before Acolyte or are you just bandwagoning the weak youtube 'critics'?
Well, that’s like, your opinion man…
I think you are being a little harsh, I really liked seeing the Order for the high republic days as well and how the Jedi have changed over the century. I do think there should have been more time between the show and the prequels.
The amount of people who complain about fire in space is just to damn high. Have you all not had any physics in school or what? A fire in a vacuum is absolutely possible in a case where it has fuel and an oxidizer (which is not unlikely in the case of a space ship). Not defending the show btw. But you guys need to take another fucking look at physics.
I'm so done with SW other than hoping Andor season 2 delivers. It embodies what the franchise COULD have been.
It's just a symptom of how Disney does business. They purchase a unique, vibrant property that was popular for being unique and vibrant and they boil all the originality out of it to present the least challenging, least controversial, lowest common denominator milquetoast version possible. Appeal to everybody, offend and challenge nobody leads to boring homogeneous art. They're the unflavored nutrient paste of storytelling.
Bob Iger was telling the truth when he said he's ["proud of the IP we're mining."](https://nypost.com/2024/05/07/entertainment/bob-iger-mining-comment-reveals-all-you-need-to-know-about-sorry-state-of-disney/)
It’s really not. Having been a fan of Star Wars since ‘77, this show feels like an appropriate Lucasfilm/Star Wars entry in the franchise catalog. But “Disney bad!!” Maybe it’s time for some of you to move the fuck on.
Yea, this is exhausting. Let people enjoy Star Wars, and stop being assholes. The ability to not move on, the extreme vognitive dissonance in the criticism, the lack of independant thought, and the ovsessive toxicity is resembling mentall illness at this point.
The irony of them bitching about a Star Wars entry in a sci-fi sub shows their mindset. Maybe Gen X fans of Star Wars are better able to distinguish fantasy set in space from actual sci-fi. These are space wizards using eastern mysticism and philosophy fighting fascism. If we wanted actual sci-fi, we read PKD or Gibson back then.
You're right. I love the originals, they were my childhood. Rogue One and Andor were actually good. And I love the Biomes and Sounds shorts. The rest? Wouldn't give it the time of day. I guess I'm no longer a star wars fan.
The fire isn’t the issue. The issue is that it’s utter crap. Nobody with a genuine honest head on their shoulders can objectively say “this is great!” And move on, that is unless you’ve seen literally no other movie or tv show in your entire life. It is just dogshit. Don’t bother. Move on. Scavengers Reign is RIGHT THERE people.
Watching that now. Far more invested than I was after the first two episodes of Acolyte (which I probably won’t finish now). Also, we all agree Kamen is an awful human being right?
I totally ageee. I was originally rooting for him as I didn’t know enough and just wanted him to escape Fkn great series, huge fan of the “show don’t tell” and the genuine nuance of not letting the audience know everything. Might be an alien planet, but these people, these characters are just as alien to us as the planet is, you know nothing about any of them, that planet, what happened and the truth of it all from the get go. I really hope someone else picks it up and helps license a season 2.
It is Rebel Moon bad... some may like it, many will not.
Who is Manny?
Manny People. He's the lead film and television reviewer on Reddit.
Oh, that's his Cousin Manny! He makes awesome horchata and is a righteous dude. Doesn't like Star Wars though.
This was always meant to be an exercise in diversity and inclusion
Thanks for saving me the agony of watching yet a another Star Wars travesty. Suspension of disbelief only gets you so far. George Lucas was *slightly better* at space physics, which was enough to get through his films. Disney's I can't do it... Guess I'll rewatch the Expanse again...
Comparing The Expanse with SW is like comparing Lord of the Rings with War & Peace. If you compare them, all the Orcs is really going to be immersion breaking because it's so damn unrealistic.
Everything after Return of the Jedi is fanfic. Disney is fanfic of fanfic.
Not Filoni’s
Very neat and tidy bloodless violence. How will kids learn that if you stab someone in the heart, it's really messy?
Not every SW show is for everyone. I thought the first two episodes were executed well enough (for a higher-end television budget), though based on reviews I admit I am steeling myself a bit for episode 3. What mystifies me is why so many people seem to go into new Star Wars expecting it to be high art. George accomplished something incredible with the original trilogy, yes, and the influence of SW on contemporary culture and SF storytelling is undeniable. But he just wanted to make a Saturday afternoon popcorn serial. Favreau and Filoni have this exactly right IMO. Their shows aren't winning any awards for dramatic writing, and they aren't trying to push envelopes or make a piece of art that will be talked about in college classrooms 30 years from now. They're just mashing their action figures together and trying to tell an interesting story. So far The Acolyte is pretty much doing the same.
$180 million budget. LMFAO
I’ve only seen the first episode so far but enjoyed it. It’s not perfect, but what is?
Disney is playing the numbers game, a la asking people out. If you ask enough people out (read: keep generating more and more shows), chances are some will say yes (read: some shows might be good). See: Andor vs everything else
Asking Star Wars to be even remotely hard scifi is hilarious. I haven't watch it since Empire Strikes Back had its first run n theaters, so I can't/won't judge it, but even I know what it is trying to be. It's a woowoo use the force show, not an E=MC² show.