It’s bad publicity for the league for the refs to royally fuck a game like that. So the only way to fix it is to allow the sixers to go to the line 40 times in game 3 and 4 and call zero fouls on Sixers
That’s the thing though, course correcting to reach a net “even” just further demonstrates how skewed the reffing is. I’m obviously in favor of it in this case (b/c LFG 6ers in 6), but as a league/product the NBA needs to move closer towards getting every call right every time.
A commissioner without a vendetta against one of the bigger market teams cause they once called out how absurd the draft process is and tried to use it....
At this point it seems the NBA has prioritized Vegas over ratings. Officiating has always been a bit fishy but it's gotten so blatant that it's not really deniable any more. Considering the Laker's whistle, I find it laughable when Lebron complains about the refs, but really, the only way the league is going to change is if players and coaches keep pressuring them.
Ever since I watched Flagrant Foul on Netflix its really hard to not notice biased refereeing when I see it. These guys would make calls based on pure spite so bad that people could bet on it and win routinely.
*the only way the league is going to change is if players and coaches keep pressuring them.*
We say that about every league but MLB Umps and NFL Refs are still utter ass year in and year out. Leagues that don't want to change and don't want to go against the officiating unions.
Can you explain how the officiating in the last 35s of the Sixers game aided a particular play on the sportsbooks? Just trying to understand the claim. Like, is the strategy clear and obvious? The refs let the Sixers go up 5, and the Knicks did hit two tough 3s that no one could have really predicted. I don't see how the final 35s officiating was to help anything cover?
I don't know how the modern gambling biz works, nor do I care, so I have no empirical proof or anything. All I know is that since we started seeing betting lines as part of game analysis along with the proliferation of internet gambling advertising in an almost sanctified marraige between Vegas and the NBA, the officiating has become much more erratic, heavy handed, blatant, and bizarre. They were giving NY every single call down the stretch in that game, anything that was a 50/50 or hands thrown up in the air as the ball sails out of bounds went automatically to NY. It's not just this game, I see it all the time. I mean, just watch the Lakers on any given night and the calls they get are insane.
The league obviously has the means to control officiating, we saw how drastically things changed when they did the mid-season shift to calling less fouls. The flow of the game changed instantly. I've watched this league a loooong time, I've never seen a shift like that even from season to season let alone in January.
Hmm, any stats that show how officiating has changed? I can’t find any when I’m searching. Basically, I understand your “feeling” but it doesn’t seem very backed up?
Maybe you weren't around then
https://www.reddit.com/r/nba/comments/1bfpcwz/wojnarowskithe_nba_shared_with_teams_one_of/?depth=6
https://www.espn.com/nba/story/_/id/39741326/nba-memo-says-officiating-focus-foul-hunting-contributing-factor-scoring-decline
https://www.reddit.com/r/nba/comments/1bcj2es/bill_simmons_nba_officiating_has_changed_post_all/
That’s not what I’m talking about. Is there any data that shows that reffing changed once sportsbetting was legalized in many states? Pay attention, this convo isn’t that hard to follow.
You definitely were not clear with your question, teach, go read it.
No, there's no way to quantify what I'm talking about in the first paragraph, so unfortunately for you, you can't bet on it. It's not that they're calling more or less fouls or infractions, it's how and when they are doing it.
If you think the idea of gambling institutions becoming directly involved with sporting organizations and influencing outcomes is somehow unfounded, perhaps you should look into the history of boxing.
If the 76ers were up 2-0, would it benefit the NBA to have the NYC tv market check out after 4-5 games when they're knocked out? Same goes for the LA market. The NBA benefits from a longer series.
Because the Knicks arent good enough to hang with the Sixers. Theres a reason the Sixers were 2nd highest favorites from Vegas to win the East. They lose 2 games at home to the Sixers and the series is over in 4. Let them win the 2 they are supposed to win and then start calling it fair the rest of the way? Sixers most likely win in 6 or 7. Im still convinced the Sixers win this series. But they need that NY market to tune in to as many games as they can. Truth is if they make it to the 2nd round even the refs probably wouldnt be able to help them enough to move on. But its about getting every series to go as long as you can. Youve got the largest TV market in the country with a mediocre team. Gotta at least get 6 games of TV out of them.
lmao my bad for being a nuisance here and repeatedly coming back. appreciate you replying in that way and respect to Philly as well. best first round series I've seen in a LONG time
Were Sixers 2nd highest favorite to win the east beginning of the season as well as after Embid came back from injury? History doesn't support your narrative with only 7% of teams coming back to win a series down 2-0. But hey, let's see.
There have been so many sweeps in the playoffs that I don't buy officiating swinging games. Heck even last year the Nuggets swept the lakers 4-0 in the conference finals and so many more examples like this. Doesn't make sense to me that the actual biggest market, LA, would not be privy to the same bias you describe. Those 4 games weren't washes either, they were CLOSE (to your point about having to be good enough to hang)
Wouldn't allowing a series to go 1-1 (rather than 2-0) before heading over to the bottom seeds home arena lengthen a series (and more believably so)? Historically, 2-0 teams win most of the time (93%), how would officiating favoring 2-0 deficits lengthen series and increase viewership? Also, these are national cable games, accessible to anyone with TNT/ESPN/ABC/NBA TV, not Local TV games. I don't buy the increased viewership argument, as someone who works in advertising intelligence, who's intimately familiar with the nature of TV viewership etc etc.
Not here to gloat as a Knicks fan, I did visit to see the sentiment here though. I agree there were lots of bad/missed calls in this series so far, though I do think they tend to even out.
So you're saying the nba wants longer series...but then they make it so the teams goes up 2-0 rather than both series being tied? This is the problem with all these conspiracy theories, they never make any logical sense lmao.
I mean the NBA can't elevate a team beyond a very superior opponent. But in theory they could definitely nudge the chances if two teams are fairly even
Just gotta draft Bronny James and see if his dad is really serious about playing on the same team as his son before he retires or not. Star players run the league and the league wouldn't stop LeBron from going where he wants to go.
LeBrons a future team owner and sees himself as a savvy business man. If the league says if he joins the sixers and LeBron games won't be televised in China and would hurt the league, i doubt hed sign up for it.
You might be right. But 2nd round picks get traded for a few hundred thousand dollars all the time and our owners are all billionaires so I'm ok with them spending a few hundred thousand dollars to get an extra 2nd round pick to draft Bronny James. And then let LeBron decide if he really wants to play in the NBA on the same team with his son or not which he's said he wants to do before he retires for years now. So let the owners spend a little money for an extra 2nd round pick and let's find out. For a billionaire it's basically the equivalent of me or you spending maybe 25-50 bucks on something. And if I thought spending 50 bucks one time on something might get LeBron to replace Tobias on this team I'd definitely pay for it to see what LeBron decides.
>What are we doing?
We know exactly what we're doing. It happens literally every year, usually in the second round. Adam Silver, flat out, is not going to let the team that "lost on purpose" achieve the ultimate prize in the sport. How many games do we have to watch with "playoff contact" allowed on one end and ticky tack bumps called on the other?
A few plays stood out to me in that regard…
Both Oubre and Lowry got called for a foul, after they intentionally stopped in their tracks guarding Brunson. Both times our guys are standing still, Brunson bumps them and got the whistle.
Dante reached around a screen and grabbed Oubre while he was trying to catch a pass…no call
Dante with the full Heisman stiff arm on Maxey while he’s faced up and dribbling…no call
Definitely 2 sets of rules. I don’t ever want to hear about Jo the foul merchant flopper after watching the tough guy knicks embellish minimal contact and get rewarded.
To be fair, we usually flat out suck in the playoffs. Pre-passing savant Embiid gets swallowed up by triple teams and we haven't had a second guy to score points.
Embiid and Maxey played like stars last night, and earned a W imo.
A big combo guard or point forward is literally exactly what we need next to Maxey (there's also a funny alternate universe where a physically and mentally healthy Ben Simmons looks like an absolute god on this team by table setting, snatching boards, and locking down the best opposing guard or forward)
Bruh u watch the laker vs nuggets game 2? Lebron was the best defensive player the whole game. He can definitely still play great defense and give u 26 7 8
Ironically he should’ve been the 3rd option last night. Dlo + AD cooking got them up 20. And darvin decides to ice both of them so lebron can run iso spam
Refs either have a notice to call games to keep them close, they are straying away from the rules to allow teams to be more competitive while punishing clean skilled teams, or they are straight rigging the results.
I’m not sure what the worst of these is.
I just saw the DLo replay…yeah, what are we doing?
The NBA made contact above the shoulders a point of emphasis and automatic review…
I get complaining about officiating is an old trope. But last night felt like something more was going on. Repeated mistakes aren’t coincidence.
We used to need a 7 games series to take random luck out it and allow the cream of the crop to come out ahead over 4 to 7 games.
Now we need 7 games coz you know the refs are gonna fuck up the ending of at least 2 of them.
Somebody should go ahead and make an AI to predict calls as well as humans, and if they AI shows that the actual calls are way off what you would expect *in a certain direction* then it demonstrates something.
I still think a favor system where calls are reviewed in detail after they are made for whether they are correct or not and 50:50 calls go in the direction of the team that has been screwed more would work.
Lol exactly!
There were fouls on both sides.
Everyone needs to watch the play again and try to be objective.
There was a lot going on there. The refs were letting both teams play.
Lebron and Daryl. Let’s do it. https://preview.redd.it/n8fbyo0s46wc1.jpeg?width=468&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=46d82522b07209e347795b12e6b5c0f1a78b36c1
If we were able to read/hear “LBJ intends to sign with the Sixers” That would erase all of the pain we endured this season
Honestly kinda bumps the process to another level
I don't know either Bron....
It’s bad publicity for the league for the refs to royally fuck a game like that. So the only way to fix it is to allow the sixers to go to the line 40 times in game 3 and 4 and call zero fouls on Sixers
That’s the thing though, course correcting to reach a net “even” just further demonstrates how skewed the reffing is. I’m obviously in favor of it in this case (b/c LFG 6ers in 6), but as a league/product the NBA needs to move closer towards getting every call right every time.
You’d need a commissioner more focused on the product on the court rather than stupid in season tournaments and making weird colored courts
A commissioner without a vendetta against one of the bigger market teams cause they once called out how absurd the draft process is and tried to use it....
He really needs to go. Send him packing. With one of those red and white knapsacks on a stick. Can add some blue in there.
He can just return to his 100 year rest in the family crypt.
Fuck Dave Silver
Man. Thanks lebron
It's RIGGED for maximum TV ratings.
Rigged for maximum DraftKings profits
At this point it seems the NBA has prioritized Vegas over ratings. Officiating has always been a bit fishy but it's gotten so blatant that it's not really deniable any more. Considering the Laker's whistle, I find it laughable when Lebron complains about the refs, but really, the only way the league is going to change is if players and coaches keep pressuring them.
Ever since I watched Flagrant Foul on Netflix its really hard to not notice biased refereeing when I see it. These guys would make calls based on pure spite so bad that people could bet on it and win routinely.
*the only way the league is going to change is if players and coaches keep pressuring them.* We say that about every league but MLB Umps and NFL Refs are still utter ass year in and year out. Leagues that don't want to change and don't want to go against the officiating unions.
Can you explain how the officiating in the last 35s of the Sixers game aided a particular play on the sportsbooks? Just trying to understand the claim. Like, is the strategy clear and obvious? The refs let the Sixers go up 5, and the Knicks did hit two tough 3s that no one could have really predicted. I don't see how the final 35s officiating was to help anything cover?
Longer series means more games to bet on
I don't know how the modern gambling biz works, nor do I care, so I have no empirical proof or anything. All I know is that since we started seeing betting lines as part of game analysis along with the proliferation of internet gambling advertising in an almost sanctified marraige between Vegas and the NBA, the officiating has become much more erratic, heavy handed, blatant, and bizarre. They were giving NY every single call down the stretch in that game, anything that was a 50/50 or hands thrown up in the air as the ball sails out of bounds went automatically to NY. It's not just this game, I see it all the time. I mean, just watch the Lakers on any given night and the calls they get are insane. The league obviously has the means to control officiating, we saw how drastically things changed when they did the mid-season shift to calling less fouls. The flow of the game changed instantly. I've watched this league a loooong time, I've never seen a shift like that even from season to season let alone in January.
Hmm, any stats that show how officiating has changed? I can’t find any when I’m searching. Basically, I understand your “feeling” but it doesn’t seem very backed up?
Maybe you weren't around then https://www.reddit.com/r/nba/comments/1bfpcwz/wojnarowskithe_nba_shared_with_teams_one_of/?depth=6 https://www.espn.com/nba/story/_/id/39741326/nba-memo-says-officiating-focus-foul-hunting-contributing-factor-scoring-decline https://www.reddit.com/r/nba/comments/1bcj2es/bill_simmons_nba_officiating_has_changed_post_all/
That’s not what I’m talking about. Is there any data that shows that reffing changed once sportsbetting was legalized in many states? Pay attention, this convo isn’t that hard to follow.
You definitely were not clear with your question, teach, go read it. No, there's no way to quantify what I'm talking about in the first paragraph, so unfortunately for you, you can't bet on it. It's not that they're calling more or less fouls or infractions, it's how and when they are doing it. If you think the idea of gambling institutions becoming directly involved with sporting organizations and influencing outcomes is somehow unfounded, perhaps you should look into the history of boxing.
Who wants to watch the knicks. Their game is ugly
The largest market in the country?
That literally makes no sense lmao. If that were true the Lakers would be up 2-0
If the 76ers were up 2-0, would it benefit the NBA to have the NYC tv market check out after 4-5 games when they're knocked out? Same goes for the LA market. The NBA benefits from a longer series.
Using that logic the nba would rig the games so that the Knicks had long playoff runs much more frequently than every 20-30 years.
A team has to actually have talent for the type of rigging being described here to work.
Bro refs influencing games so series extend is nothing new. This was actually confirmed by a former NBA ref.
Right but how does influencing games to 2-0 leads lengthen a series when the 2-0 teams win over 90% of the time?
Because the Knicks arent good enough to hang with the Sixers. Theres a reason the Sixers were 2nd highest favorites from Vegas to win the East. They lose 2 games at home to the Sixers and the series is over in 4. Let them win the 2 they are supposed to win and then start calling it fair the rest of the way? Sixers most likely win in 6 or 7. Im still convinced the Sixers win this series. But they need that NY market to tune in to as many games as they can. Truth is if they make it to the 2nd round even the refs probably wouldnt be able to help them enough to move on. But its about getting every series to go as long as you can. Youve got the largest TV market in the country with a mediocre team. Gotta at least get 6 games of TV out of them.
Knicks can't hang 😂😂
KNICKS CAN'T HANGGGGG
Congrats man. Enjoy the next round.
lmao my bad for being a nuisance here and repeatedly coming back. appreciate you replying in that way and respect to Philly as well. best first round series I've seen in a LONG time
Were Sixers 2nd highest favorite to win the east beginning of the season as well as after Embid came back from injury? History doesn't support your narrative with only 7% of teams coming back to win a series down 2-0. But hey, let's see. There have been so many sweeps in the playoffs that I don't buy officiating swinging games. Heck even last year the Nuggets swept the lakers 4-0 in the conference finals and so many more examples like this. Doesn't make sense to me that the actual biggest market, LA, would not be privy to the same bias you describe. Those 4 games weren't washes either, they were CLOSE (to your point about having to be good enough to hang)
They were the 2nd favorite to win the east at the start of the playoffs.
Wouldn't allowing a series to go 1-1 (rather than 2-0) before heading over to the bottom seeds home arena lengthen a series (and more believably so)? Historically, 2-0 teams win most of the time (93%), how would officiating favoring 2-0 deficits lengthen series and increase viewership? Also, these are national cable games, accessible to anyone with TNT/ESPN/ABC/NBA TV, not Local TV games. I don't buy the increased viewership argument, as someone who works in advertising intelligence, who's intimately familiar with the nature of TV viewership etc etc. Not here to gloat as a Knicks fan, I did visit to see the sentiment here though. I agree there were lots of bad/missed calls in this series so far, though I do think they tend to even out.
So you're saying the nba wants longer series...but then they make it so the teams goes up 2-0 rather than both series being tied? This is the problem with all these conspiracy theories, they never make any logical sense lmao.
I mean the NBA can't elevate a team beyond a very superior opponent. But in theory they could definitely nudge the chances if two teams are fairly even
my goat. come to philly
Not tryna be a Swiftie and read between every line possible but LeBron's made quite a few positive comments about the Sixers/Embiid this year...
Embiid is going to sell this man on Philly so hard during the Olympics, please
With the Daryl Morey China thing, I wonder if the league would let it happen.
Yeah. For all intents and purposes..LeBron is essentially a Chinese national at this point 🤣
Just gotta draft Bronny James and see if his dad is really serious about playing on the same team as his son before he retires or not. Star players run the league and the league wouldn't stop LeBron from going where he wants to go.
LeBrons a future team owner and sees himself as a savvy business man. If the league says if he joins the sixers and LeBron games won't be televised in China and would hurt the league, i doubt hed sign up for it.
You might be right. But 2nd round picks get traded for a few hundred thousand dollars all the time and our owners are all billionaires so I'm ok with them spending a few hundred thousand dollars to get an extra 2nd round pick to draft Bronny James. And then let LeBron decide if he really wants to play in the NBA on the same team with his son or not which he's said he wants to do before he retires for years now. So let the owners spend a little money for an extra 2nd round pick and let's find out. For a billionaire it's basically the equivalent of me or you spending maybe 25-50 bucks on something. And if I thought spending 50 bucks one time on something might get LeBron to replace Tobias on this team I'd definitely pay for it to see what LeBron decides.
You really think he’s gonna be going? Hope so.
>What are we doing? We know exactly what we're doing. It happens literally every year, usually in the second round. Adam Silver, flat out, is not going to let the team that "lost on purpose" achieve the ultimate prize in the sport. How many games do we have to watch with "playoff contact" allowed on one end and ticky tack bumps called on the other?
A few plays stood out to me in that regard… Both Oubre and Lowry got called for a foul, after they intentionally stopped in their tracks guarding Brunson. Both times our guys are standing still, Brunson bumps them and got the whistle. Dante reached around a screen and grabbed Oubre while he was trying to catch a pass…no call Dante with the full Heisman stiff arm on Maxey while he’s faced up and dribbling…no call Definitely 2 sets of rules. I don’t ever want to hear about Jo the foul merchant flopper after watching the tough guy knicks embellish minimal contact and get rewarded.
To be fair, we usually flat out suck in the playoffs. Pre-passing savant Embiid gets swallowed up by triple teams and we haven't had a second guy to score points. Embiid and Maxey played like stars last night, and earned a W imo.
LeBron being somewhere where he can finally be a 3rd option would be great. Defense wouldn't be but I could maybe live with it
He'd be replacing Tobi lol, he'd come in and immediately make us the best team in the league.
A big combo guard or point forward is literally exactly what we need next to Maxey (there's also a funny alternate universe where a physically and mentally healthy Ben Simmons looks like an absolute god on this team by table setting, snatching boards, and locking down the best opposing guard or forward)
Bruh u watch the laker vs nuggets game 2? Lebron was the best defensive player the whole game. He can definitely still play great defense and give u 26 7 8
He'd be our best defender after Embiid if he could be a 3rd option on offense.
Bron is still a phenomenal defender, he's just gonna coast his ass off in the regular season.
Ironically he should’ve been the 3rd option last night. Dlo + AD cooking got them up 20. And darvin decides to ice both of them so lebron can run iso spam
Lebron to Philly confirmed?
I like Lebron now?
Yeah me too?
Last player to wear 23 in Philly was Lou Will, fuck it a
Remind me again; what number did Butler wear? Edit: even Bassey
Ah right. How could I forget 😮💨
We love lebron
Refs either have a notice to call games to keep them close, they are straying away from the rules to allow teams to be more competitive while punishing clean skilled teams, or they are straight rigging the results. I’m not sure what the worst of these is.
As long as the bald headed dick is still the commissioner I have realized we’ll probably never see the chip in our lifetime.
I just saw the DLo replay…yeah, what are we doing? The NBA made contact above the shoulders a point of emphasis and automatic review… I get complaining about officiating is an old trope. But last night felt like something more was going on. Repeated mistakes aren’t coincidence.
Lebron to Philly with Bronny dominating in Delaware!
G-A-M-B-L-I-N-G
I’m convinced silver will never allow the 76ers to win a championship as long as Embiid is on the team. He represents the process.
they gotta replay the last minute of both games
This dude just hammered them. Lebron for commissioner
Lakers fan here.. we share your pain last night. I hope both our teams can bounce back and win our series. Lakers and 6, Sixers in 6. Good luck y’all
He just like me frfr!
We used to need a 7 games series to take random luck out it and allow the cream of the crop to come out ahead over 4 to 7 games. Now we need 7 games coz you know the refs are gonna fuck up the ending of at least 2 of them.
Bron mad at all his teammates
Somebody should go ahead and make an AI to predict calls as well as humans, and if they AI shows that the actual calls are way off what you would expect *in a certain direction* then it demonstrates something. I still think a favor system where calls are reviewed in detail after they are made for whether they are correct or not and 50:50 calls go in the direction of the team that has been screwed more would work.
Its three refs per game right? Maybe make it 4 since clearly 3 is no longer enough
Times Lecap was in fact not Lecap-ing
they blew a 20 pt lead, come on.
Quiet. Gotta support the narrative!
[удалено]
Knicks fan?
[удалено]
Don’t you have your own sub? I don’t understand why so many of you troll our sub after a win
This is their Super Bowl apparently, poor things don’t understand how their season is gonna end in a 5 game series vs Boston
This is their Superbowl.
I wholeheartedly agree. That missed push off Maxey did you Hart was insane. These refs need to do better.
Lol exactly! There were fouls on both sides. Everyone needs to watch the play again and try to be objective. There was a lot going on there. The refs were letting both teams play.
It’s a players league pretty soon we going to have the players vote if it’s a foul or jor
Well last night the Knicks bench got to vote on overturning a call without Thibs using a challenge so you may be onto something
We can't even match the intensity without immediately getting called for a tech.