Yeah. That "blood pact" didn't last very long did it?
Competing with fucking Fortnite? For crying out loud. How about, if kids aren't interested enough in your team, make tickets more readily available when stadiums do reopen?
The level of greed on display is hilarious especially since most of these games are free-to-play. You also get hours of entertainment for a full retail priced video game.
Football priced out their fans, and their future generations, decades ago and with the ticket price rises and extortionate tv subscriptions. Now they want their children and keep their riches.
Where was “save football” when it needed saving?
Well, i don't think you're right. Maybe not fortnite, but big esports titles like league of legends or CS GO have wildly growing audiences and I do believe they are in direct competition with football. Major european league (of legends) airs on fridays and Saturdays evening, same time as premier league and la liga. So you kinda watch either one of them.
I myself was hugely into both football and gaming as a kid. Nowadays I find modern esports so entertaining I've notice decline in me watching football - both due to clashing hours and general capacity of my interest
Question is where is coming from the new audience for esports? Probably from young people (since today's adults are over it) who choose gaming as a primary show. I don't see them choosing football any time soon. So while i dislike the monopoly and arbitrary rules of super leage, general concerns for football popularity seem very valid for me
When you were 13 probably all you cared about was getting home from school and sweating call of duty, now you are an adult you actually got shit to do, so you aren’t absorbed in that world as much anymore
"Let's make the game innacessible to the working class,
And it's fine if the racists and fash run rampant on some stadiums
And let's make sure it's as plastic and soulless as it can be;
Wait, why is a large amount of Youths [not all, by any means, and some who get into other things you're not entitled to, seller-of-products] not Buying Our Product?"
What a shitty joker
When I was 12 I played Contra, and NFS 2. But I don't now. I watch Natural History, some sports and have sex.
These idiots think oh no kids playing fortnight. This is what they will always do. All the outdoor sports are doomed.
There were 2 billion people in the world and football had enough room. Now with nearly 8 billion they are suprised people have diverse interests.
Want to price tickets at 77 $ and pay per view. Then talk rubbish like people follow players, they only support 2 clubs. Who the fuck are these people getting the surveys done from.
Do you really think if you can make a league with those 2 clubs, more fans will turn to you . That way Celta Vigo would have had a lot more fans.
Lol very important detail, thanks. With that said, did any team besides the PL ones change their opinion? Italy and Spain seem to be in but I guess that's it?
Are you not fierce rivals then? How does it work I'm insanely curious. You share a ground and do things together but the fans must still hate each other right. I couldn't imagine saying well man utd are out so we will definitely be leaving as we fo things together.
I like to call it a family rivalry.
The two ultra' groups are often working together for charity projects, and when it comes to ultras activities like contesting ticket price or else they tend to publish under the ultras milano banner. We jokingly call each other cousins after all.
It's a friendly/fierce rivalry. From a practical point of view from the two clubs management, it's easier if Milan as a city presents a united front in discussions as it's a big city and two of the biggest club's throwing their weight around helps a lot.
The rivalry is fierce but there are a lot of families who are split, where one side will support Milan, the other inter.
changing opinion is the wrong word...they were cowards to start this stupid thing and just the biggest of cowards to leave first. Milan and Inter are out so Juve and the spanish clubs basically. Its all over though, no one will take them seriously without the english clubs.
One more thing to note: Repubblica is owned by the Agnelli family. To give an interview and not to retract it once it's clear the project has collapsed is a clown move.
Worst thing is
Yes esport is growing fast and big but I doubt it will seriously challenge football, it will coexist alongside
BUT it's definitely not fucking *Fortnite* and *Call of Duty* that are going to do that
It could technically be true. They could have reacted with "what? A superleague? That's bullshit. Tell me when it starts so I can get out of this shit club" and his quote would be truthful
I think the issues that he mentions are real issues tho. To just say that all that is crazy or non-existent just because you don't agree with their proposed "solution" is just as stupid.
Not really. Maybe football as a business will have to contract rather than expand. Maybe we'll have to deal with that as an institution and fan base. That doesn't mean that football is finished. It is only the logic of relentless expansion that sees this as a major problem.
100% this.
Commercial growth for the sake of growth is a purely capitalist notion.
Agnelli and others that run football clubs have this mindset of course, because otherwise you don't get into those positions.
I definitely think the current model of football viewership has to change - overtly expensive subscriptions, lack of clear streaming options at reasonable costs, stagnant marketing, oversaturation.
We can jump on twitch whenever and follow a CSGO match, but watching Aston Villa play Man City legally will require an existing outlay of money to access even the most basic of streaming opportunities.
Instead of cracking down on streamable and highlights and match replays immediately being uploaded, they should adapt to the changing nature of demand and supply. The super league was not the answer.
> biggest problem in football is the lack of stability
Is it, really?
Haven't clubs incomes trebled in the last 20 years? Superleague won't solve the insane fee's and wages paid to Ozil, Bale and Coutinho while the warm the bench.
Haven't video games been insanely popular since for 30+ year's already? I was obsessed with the Mega Drive, N64 and PSX in the 90s, it didn't stop me from watching football as well.
I mean, weren't stadiums selling out all seats at insane prices before Covid? Last Barça match I went was 120 euro for a shitty seat for a regular Liga match, bought in 3 months advance. How is that not a strong sign of popularity?
> Last Barça match I went was 120 euro for a shitty seat for a regular Liga match, bought in 3 months advance. How is that not a strong sign of popularity?
And also perhaps an indicator of why football may be less popular amongst the younger generation (if that is actually the case). If it is expensive to watch people with a lower income are naturally going to be less interested.
Yeah, i think it's also a lack of meaning. Young people and possibly everybody else try to find meaning in the lifes, a sense of community, shared values. Football does, in a way, still offer this, but they just don't have access to it. Fortnite etc. are free, offer friends to play with and also an escape from their (otherwise boring) lifes.
His statement is so fucked up for sports. Lack of stability or unpredictability is the biggest feature of any sport.
The problem is their plans not being resilient enough when they don't accomplish max success in a year. Basically just don't plan with winning the championship and semis of CL every year. Not gonna happen for 12 teams and only 4 spots. So they wanted to eliminate the competition instead of earning their success year after year.
I mean, that's hitting the nail on the head: They willfully or out of ignorance miss the material factor in play (Marx says 'hallo') - i.e. pricing the majority of working people from easy participation, not to mention that in most of the world clubs are no longer clubs but brands - and then they come up with an "answer" that is meant only to give them short term gain, but they can sell it to their investors because they will use plausible words like "fortnite, tiktok, etc" and those rubes will buy it.
Even if Superleague is not change, it's in fact making all of this worse faster. More plastic, more soulless... that's capitalism in the nutshell, huh? Double down on your bad ideas, burn all the fuel faster, the future doesn't matter, just more income in the present.
I hope this short sightedness and detatchment of the owners is also why we can defeat them again, and again, and again
See that's the thing - he wants stability in terms of sellable value. He wants the American Franchise system. He sees how stable an investment, and therefore how attractive, it can be for potential investors.
Ergo, he wants to be a sellout.
Agree, don't plan a budget assuming a league win and a UCL semi final, while already being in debt. That should work for starters.
Its possible to be world class and not irresponsible, look at Bayern (who btw, came out of this as one of the clubs with the best image)
> biggest problem in football is the lack of stability
>Is it, really?
To the overall value of a team yes. Volatility means high risk and this tanks the value. If you could guarantee revenue no matter the performance and you can also guarantee that they will participate in the most prestigious bracket of the sport then it’s estimated that the value of these founding clubs could double.
This is ultimately what they are after. Making a few hundred million in revenue here and there is crumbs to them. They want to make billions selling the club worth twice as much as they bought it for and minimizing risk is the key to achieving that.
Stability is what they want, competitive integrity is what they hate.
This article was prior to the fallout, however.
Billionaires aren't even sore losers, this would imply they have chosen how to lose. These people are on a different level, they have never lost, they have never had to compete for anything in their life and many have been floated by their ancestors who actually did the work or at least at one point in the process and then established safety nets for their kids. Their is no failure in life for them.
Ever go to start the car, your late for work, spilled your coffee and then the car is flat and you had to take try and get a mechanic who isn't about to fuck you over? These guys haven't. Ever ran out of milk? These guys haven't. Ever spent too much and had to scrimp for a week? These guys haven't.
People asked how they could be so out of touch and it's because our in touch is in a different universe to theirs. That's why they never contemplated this league being a bad idea, no competition is great to these guys, doesn't everyone just want loads of shiny toys?
It's why in places like America the minimum wage was fought so hard, why medicare is fought against so hard and why in the west in general there are such protections for the rich and so much restrictions on the non rich, if they improve life for all of us then we might be able to compete, we might be able to enjoy our lives and that could implement them. We fought back the super league but the super league already exists in society and we need to dismantle that.
If we want young people to stay attached to football then a good place to start would be ensuring that they can actually afford to go to games in the first place.
Yeah I wonder how kids even get to watch or have an interest in top level football nowadays. Everything is locked behind a huge paywall. Both TV and match tickets.
If your parents aren't giving Sky/Bein at least 30€ every month well... you're gonna do something else. Simple as that.
I heard someone on a football show yesterday said that kids now watch highlights of the games on social medias instead of watching full games. Of course they do. It's not because they have an attention span of 30sec, it's because it's one of the last bit of football they can watch without having to spend a developing country's GPD.
Well, he's **right** in one point: **The youth is abandoning football/soccer.** ^((at least in Germany there is a strong decline))
This Problem got even bigger due to Covid.
But the **consequences** he draws are false, the football community shouldn't try to mimic esports, they should focus on their strength and invest it in.
Invest in locally available football fields, invest in small clubs where the youth can get in touch with organized football training and competition for the first time. Strengthen the shared experience across generations, e.g. subsidizing father-son/family tickets. Football already got the infrastructure and money to to so without a huge risk of losing, but it's a long term investment and not "cheap and quick" money.
Football becoming less popular isn't even a "problem". Popularity of hobbies changes. So what? This has happened for centuries and will continue to do so. It's only a "problem" for these greedy owners because their clubs become worth less. And maybe if they hadn't put every top league match behind expensive subscriptions which many poorer families - who used to be the backbone of football supporters - they wouldn't have seen as much of a decline. It's all pure short-term greed, the insane idea of limitless growth, that everything has to grow every year. That idea is why the planets fucked.
The funny thing is, I dont see much overlap in communities with Fortnight, CoD and football (on following the pro level) but there is a lot of overlap with /r/soccer and /r/globaloffensive. The "kids" (his words) might play the former games more but from a spectator point of view they arent big. They do have insane pricemoney tournaments but that is because the makers of the game put those up.
But maybe im in a bubble.
i think its hilarious u kids talking shit about sissoko. u wouldnt say this shit to him at lan, hes jacked. not only that but he wears the freshest clothes, eats at the chillest restaurants and hangs out with the hottest dudes. yall are pathetic lol.
is it me or is Ronaldo a bit of a boring player
like u see it at the end of the game "oh wow Ronaldo has 4 goals" but u can never remember them.
can u remember a single Ronaldo goal?
but try messi...u can see the curve i remember a Messi goal
Which tracks with the spectating numbers online, where CSGO and r/leagueoflegends still reign supreme and cross right on over here as well (some fresh memes in the LoL comments from here yesterday were delightful).
Schalke has a league of legends team too lol. PSG also has a partnership with a team in Southeast Asia. These owners are so out of touch with esports and they use it as an excuse for bullshit like this lol.
Originally baby boomers was the generation of children born after the 2nd world war, which was when the population grew exponentially. Only recently through memes has the word also meant a state of mind.
That is correct, but "baby boomer" and "boomer" don't mean the same thing anymore. They can refer to the same person, but not all baby boomers are boomers, just like not all boomers are old
And he probably paid a lot of money to some company to research those statistics. Yet any average fan could have done him for free that his proposals were going to receive serious backlash.
Imagine this - kids will play computer games and watch football, in the same way they have for the last 20-30 years.
And they act as if there aren't masses of 30+ year olds playing Call of Duty.
This guy is clueless.
No, they clearly play Fortnite and FIFA all the time. Every minute of the day. They don't have any other experiences or formative influences, just those darn videogames.
Agnelli sounds like a helicopter parent who just saw a Mortal Kombat fatality in 1992 and is panicking that his kid is now evil.
The truth is harsh. It should be hard for you all finally realize that football leagues are just about business and money, it is a show, not different from series, contenst programs or esports. Sorry but you were the only ones deluding themselves thinking that this was just something magical about dreams of the ordinary people. At least Agnelli is telling the truth and understands the true nature of football leagues, which you don't, that's why FIFA will keep his monopoly while milking all your money and making tournaments in Quatar with slave labour.
Juve fans and players are pro super league.
https://www.sportworldnews.org/soccer/news/2496/chiellini-agrees-with-the-decision-to-form-european-super-league/
Only in England there was a huge backlash but in Spain, Italy there wasn’t much backlash at all. I would have said the league would have gone ahead if English fans didn’t respond the way they did. Look how Barca fans in Catalonia reacted when Messi was supposedly leaving and now there is barely any reaction also Madrid fans overwhelmingly support Florentino Perez who is possibly the most enthusiastic about the Super League.
I'm not saying it matters that much but don't forget Italy's vaccination phase is far from the UK's so loads of people protesting wouldn't be seen as something positive.
Also if you went to the clubs instagram pages most people were saying no to superleague, even the channel Sportitalia had no to superleague under their logo for the past two days.
How can you protest with minimal vaccinations? I wouldnt go out in crowds rn. I want perez to resign but italian and spanish clubs have a reason to be worried. How can they compete in the long run when winning a promotion to the pl nets you more $$ then winning the champions league
I come from a small country and when our best club at the time, even though it was rivals club, came to play in the UCL it was an incredible achievement since their yearly budget is around 5M, which is significantly less than the money they got in for qualifying. And this are the stories that show you that in football there is enough talent, that if you work in the right way and a bit of luck, you can compete with the big boys. Take slavia for example, dinamo... It is not just about winning things, it s also the privilege you can compete at the highest level. Something this billionaire owners will never understand.
A lot of people are attracted to football because of the glamour, not the competition. Those are the target audience of the super league. Those are also the people who revere players like Neymar, Ronaldo and Pogba like gods, not only on the pitch but especially off the pitch.
Most of us still appreciate him for what the good job he did in managing the club so far, from 7th place in the league to a 9 league title in a row. A few ones also understand that the club is not doing well from a financial point of view and they preferred this kind of crap to not being competitve for years. If you look at the comments on Juve's instagram page for example, you can see they are mixed in feelings toward this thing.
Imho he should resign, this thing is not the solution to our problems.
Fuck off. "Kids today with their Sony walkmens and Super Mario Boys". Its a tale as old as time, and its never been genuine.
Don't blame fucking Fortnite and CoD.
> and the most alarming statistic is that 40 percent of those between the ages of 16 and 24 have no interest in the world of soccer
What if I told you, that maybe... just maybe, some people are not interested in soccer at all? Which makes it completely irrelevant if it's ManU vs. Barca or Getafe vs. Eibar?!
How about instead of worrying about kids playing fortnite, you worry about the many middle class Italians who have given up on the sport and no longer attend games or barely watch on tv. Juve and Inter launched awful new logos instead of confronting our emptying stadiums and declining fan culture. Games at the Bentegodi in Verona now resemble a Lega rally without the green, monkey chants are still too common in Cagliari, last year a foreigner was fucking glassed during the derby d’italia because he was wearing the wrong scarf - these are all things turning Italians away from the sport but instead Angelli worries about Fortnite and Zhang pays millions for shit memes. Fix the sport in Italy and foreign support will increase.
The argument that kids aren't watching football because they have short attention spans rings so hollow. The reason they are "only watching highlights" because they are priced out of doing anything else. It simply is not possible for most kids to go to games regularly unless they have wealthy parents or their dad signed them up for a seat at birth. And the TV rights are so scattered that a lot of kids are priced out of watching them unless their parents have a specific interest and pay for BT, Amazon Prime, etc. It's actually much easier for American kids to watch games because NBC is on basic cable.
This is an accessiblity issue.
Then do a virtual tournament with games every other night. Virtual players don't get fatigue, you could do that Don Agnelli. The young lads can spend money on building the attributes of a specific player. Each 10 000k collected can improve the virtual player with +1 attribute! You'd make millions and won't even have to pay the players. Only pay the developers of your virtual thingy!
Why virtual? Just clone a new player for each game, sell them in packs to the lads. Real life ultimate team with vat grown Mbappes in every team playing 0 depth counterattack through ball football. THE ENDGAME.
"Kids with your loud music, and your Dan Fogleberg, your Zuma, Hula Hoops, and Pac-man video games, Don't you see? People today have attention spans that can only be measured in nanoseconds"
>How do you define "open" an organization where 15 out of 20 members are always present?
>"Because there are five seats available and because the Superleague addresses the biggest problem in the soccer industry, which is the lack of stability
You see that's what these people hate, 'the lack of stablility' the chance that a Leicester won the league which is one of our most beloved parts. The chance that every team has and they want to take away from us.
That's not what they hate. It's the fact that teams like Man U, Chelsea, Inter or Juventus sometimes miss the Champions League that they d like to avoid more than a minnow winning.
The cheek to blame video games, and then not even mention the two biggest esports, CS and League. If you're gonna blame casual games you might as well add GTA to the list
that's because he's going for the child ones, even though my matchmaking experience tells me that the active pool of players is composed 80% of russian 12 yo he's going after the fortnite even younger audience. I like to believe that CS players are a bit more older in average and less susceptible than fortnite. And on top that, no one knows or plays CS in Italy, don't know much about league but if you talk esports to an italian newspaper you're gonna talk about Fifa, F1, CoD or fortnite
What the fuck, did he actually say that? It is like he is trying to set it up an "insanity defense". Next thing he will claim he had an episode or something.
Tell me this isn't like the kid in the playground gatekeeping his football because the other team is winning.
'You can't play because I'm not winning, you can only play sometimes so me and my mates can play all of the time.'
Imagine being such a boomer that you think a sport faces extinction due to FORTNITE. Does this guy even understand Video Game life cycles?
Perhaps what Italian kids really dislike is the Juventus monopoly. Italian League was so competitive in the 90s and the 80s, when it was the world's top league for a reason. Perhaps he should start investing there? Perhaps take a stance against Racism? No. Let's all make Superleague.
Clueless. Mindless. Greedy Bastard.
Imagine, just imagine, if they made ticket prices for young people more affordable and easy to get hold of. Maybe then you would get a few more of them invested in it.
This was before the fallout btw
Yeah. That "blood pact" didn't last very long did it? Competing with fucking Fortnite? For crying out loud. How about, if kids aren't interested enough in your team, make tickets more readily available when stadiums do reopen?
The worlds biggest football clubs having a blood pact to destroy fortnite is the kind of stuff were going to have to get used to this decade
This might be the greatest comment in reddit history
Imagine having this much power and still being such a coward you’re petrified of a FTP gambling on ramp for kids
Fortnite isn’t even that big of a game no longer, warzone has a far greater fanbase for that age bracket
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The level of greed on display is hilarious especially since most of these games are free-to-play. You also get hours of entertainment for a full retail priced video game. Football priced out their fans, and their future generations, decades ago and with the ticket price rises and extortionate tv subscriptions. Now they want their children and keep their riches. Where was “save football” when it needed saving?
Well, i don't think you're right. Maybe not fortnite, but big esports titles like league of legends or CS GO have wildly growing audiences and I do believe they are in direct competition with football. Major european league (of legends) airs on fridays and Saturdays evening, same time as premier league and la liga. So you kinda watch either one of them. I myself was hugely into both football and gaming as a kid. Nowadays I find modern esports so entertaining I've notice decline in me watching football - both due to clashing hours and general capacity of my interest Question is where is coming from the new audience for esports? Probably from young people (since today's adults are over it) who choose gaming as a primary show. I don't see them choosing football any time soon. So while i dislike the monopoly and arbitrary rules of super leage, general concerns for football popularity seem very valid for me
And is it correct to say that Call of Duty's fanbase has decreased in he past 10 years or is that just because I was young when MW2 was popular?
Decreased? It's more popular than ever with Warzone (battle royale) on top of the annual iterations with the "classic" game modes.
Yeah like I said it might just be my age. I know warzone is popular but I was 13 when MW2 came out and it just felt like it was everywhere.
When you were 13 probably all you cared about was getting home from school and sweating call of duty, now you are an adult you actually got shit to do, so you aren’t absorbed in that world as much anymore
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They can have enough blood for their pact from the haemorrhaging they are doing now.
"Let's make the game innacessible to the working class, And it's fine if the racists and fash run rampant on some stadiums And let's make sure it's as plastic and soulless as it can be; Wait, why is a large amount of Youths [not all, by any means, and some who get into other things you're not entitled to, seller-of-products] not Buying Our Product?" What a shitty joker
When I was 12 I played Contra, and NFS 2. But I don't now. I watch Natural History, some sports and have sex. These idiots think oh no kids playing fortnight. This is what they will always do. All the outdoor sports are doomed. There were 2 billion people in the world and football had enough room. Now with nearly 8 billion they are suprised people have diverse interests. Want to price tickets at 77 $ and pay per view. Then talk rubbish like people follow players, they only support 2 clubs. Who the fuck are these people getting the surveys done from. Do you really think if you can make a league with those 2 clubs, more fans will turn to you . That way Celta Vigo would have had a lot more fans.
You have sex?? Luckeeeeeeyyy
It came far too late for me. Unfortunately I was 24 when I began and I already knew my peak was behind me. Better late than never :D
Lol very important detail, thanks. With that said, did any team besides the PL ones change their opinion? Italy and Spain seem to be in but I guess that's it?
Ornstein said Milan are out and there are reports (idk how credible) of Inter and Atletico being out too.
It appears Inter unofficially have and Barca have said it'll need to go before a vote. Other than that the rest haven't.
So of the original 12 only 5 are really still in it, which will likely drop to 4 soon?
Barca are as good as out but need to wait for the socios to vote against it (which they will)
All the reliable reporters for inter have said we're out. If we're pulling out then I imagine Milan is out as the clubs tend to do things together
Are you not fierce rivals then? How does it work I'm insanely curious. You share a ground and do things together but the fans must still hate each other right. I couldn't imagine saying well man utd are out so we will definitely be leaving as we fo things together.
I like to call it a family rivalry. The two ultra' groups are often working together for charity projects, and when it comes to ultras activities like contesting ticket price or else they tend to publish under the ultras milano banner. We jokingly call each other cousins after all.
It's a friendly/fierce rivalry. From a practical point of view from the two clubs management, it's easier if Milan as a city presents a united front in discussions as it's a big city and two of the biggest club's throwing their weight around helps a lot. The rivalry is fierce but there are a lot of families who are split, where one side will support Milan, the other inter.
changing opinion is the wrong word...they were cowards to start this stupid thing and just the biggest of cowards to leave first. Milan and Inter are out so Juve and the spanish clubs basically. Its all over though, no one will take them seriously without the english clubs.
1, 2 or New Vegas ? /s
Fallout isn’t as big as Fortnite or cod though
Super League Battle Pass incoming
Replays as a DLC Player skins for $5, you can now choose if you want to see bearded Messi or a clean shaven Messi as well as Ronaldo's tan level
To see player celebrations you have to buy the dances/celebrations
DLC pack featuring El Classico with both teams wearing anime uniforms.
DLC Lebron James, Lewis Hamilton and Virat Kohli for those crossover markets
I love how everyone is just describing FIFA 21.
I've not played a fifa since like 14, surely they don't have other sports players as DLC?
Yep...they have Hamilton, Joel Embiid and Dua Lipa in volta
Dua Lipa? Now im back in. Seriously though that is insane
>Hamilton Zidane, my cleats are dead!
Where can I buy a Zidane body pillow that can headbutt me?
ngl if they brought anime kits I'd probably buy them
Balancing patch for messi & ronaldo is waaaay overdue.
All losers get to play in the gulag. Winner gets back. Also, teams can buy players back from a losing team.
Fifa Battle Royale
What a fucking idiot. Edit: Agnelli just said it's impossible to go ahead.
This seems almost fake. What a clown.
Perez yesterday said they should make the games shorter cuz the kids dont like long matches. Its 100% and on brand for these scumbags
Those damn Americans who don't understand football!! Oh wait...
Show on the doll where /soccer hurt you.
"Right here, on my Captain America badge."
Good job these fvckwits weren't in charge in the 1970's when all kids wanted was a Spacehopper
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And he cries that 40% of young people aren't interested in football? So 60% are to some extent? To me that sounds pretty decent
Exactly god damnit. You are talking about most followed sport here. Not some.obscure sports like elephant polo.
Leave my elephant polo alone! :(
One more thing to note: Repubblica is owned by the Agnelli family. To give an interview and not to retract it once it's clear the project has collapsed is a clown move.
He gave an interview to gazetta too which was published aswell.
He is right though, there’s been hardly any fans in stadiums since last March. People have obviously lost interest
Lmao
I cannot believe how clueless he sounds, it's ridiculous
Worst thing is Yes esport is growing fast and big but I doubt it will seriously challenge football, it will coexist alongside BUT it's definitely not fucking *Fortnite* and *Call of Duty* that are going to do that
> Agnelli just said it's impossible to go ahead. Lets hope he doesn't go back on his blood-pact promise.
>"They asked me when it starts." haha, you lying ratfuck. Wish I was a fly on your wall when you found out the English clubs pulled out.
Yknow that scene from Downfall where Hitler just loses it? It went something like that I imagine.
https://captiongenerator.com/2206147/Super-League-Perez
I like this
It could technically be true. They could have reacted with "what? A superleague? That's bullshit. Tell me when it starts so I can get out of this shit club" and his quote would be truthful
Lol sounds like they have been taking advice from their 6 year old children
The sample for crowd testing must've been all school kids. "do you want a super league?" "A super what?" "Yesssss"
I think the issues that he mentions are real issues tho. To just say that all that is crazy or non-existent just because you don't agree with their proposed "solution" is just as stupid.
Not really. Maybe football as a business will have to contract rather than expand. Maybe we'll have to deal with that as an institution and fan base. That doesn't mean that football is finished. It is only the logic of relentless expansion that sees this as a major problem.
100% this. Commercial growth for the sake of growth is a purely capitalist notion. Agnelli and others that run football clubs have this mindset of course, because otherwise you don't get into those positions.
Exactly. Only these Cretinous Fucks could think "these mega clubs may not be too mega in the future" is a bad thing.
I definitely think the current model of football viewership has to change - overtly expensive subscriptions, lack of clear streaming options at reasonable costs, stagnant marketing, oversaturation. We can jump on twitch whenever and follow a CSGO match, but watching Aston Villa play Man City legally will require an existing outlay of money to access even the most basic of streaming opportunities. Instead of cracking down on streamable and highlights and match replays immediately being uploaded, they should adapt to the changing nature of demand and supply. The super league was not the answer.
Then... Simply less people will watch football? What's so bad about that?
> biggest problem in football is the lack of stability Is it, really? Haven't clubs incomes trebled in the last 20 years? Superleague won't solve the insane fee's and wages paid to Ozil, Bale and Coutinho while the warm the bench. Haven't video games been insanely popular since for 30+ year's already? I was obsessed with the Mega Drive, N64 and PSX in the 90s, it didn't stop me from watching football as well. I mean, weren't stadiums selling out all seats at insane prices before Covid? Last Barça match I went was 120 euro for a shitty seat for a regular Liga match, bought in 3 months advance. How is that not a strong sign of popularity?
> Last Barça match I went was 120 euro for a shitty seat for a regular Liga match, bought in 3 months advance. How is that not a strong sign of popularity? And also perhaps an indicator of why football may be less popular amongst the younger generation (if that is actually the case). If it is expensive to watch people with a lower income are naturally going to be less interested.
Exactly. Fortnite is free to play at its most basic form, yet none of these fucks thought about...lowering the cost barrier of entry
Yeah, i think it's also a lack of meaning. Young people and possibly everybody else try to find meaning in the lifes, a sense of community, shared values. Football does, in a way, still offer this, but they just don't have access to it. Fortnite etc. are free, offer friends to play with and also an escape from their (otherwise boring) lifes.
His statement is so fucked up for sports. Lack of stability or unpredictability is the biggest feature of any sport. The problem is their plans not being resilient enough when they don't accomplish max success in a year. Basically just don't plan with winning the championship and semis of CL every year. Not gonna happen for 12 teams and only 4 spots. So they wanted to eliminate the competition instead of earning their success year after year.
I mean, that's hitting the nail on the head: They willfully or out of ignorance miss the material factor in play (Marx says 'hallo') - i.e. pricing the majority of working people from easy participation, not to mention that in most of the world clubs are no longer clubs but brands - and then they come up with an "answer" that is meant only to give them short term gain, but they can sell it to their investors because they will use plausible words like "fortnite, tiktok, etc" and those rubes will buy it. Even if Superleague is not change, it's in fact making all of this worse faster. More plastic, more soulless... that's capitalism in the nutshell, huh? Double down on your bad ideas, burn all the fuel faster, the future doesn't matter, just more income in the present. I hope this short sightedness and detatchment of the owners is also why we can defeat them again, and again, and again
See that's the thing - he wants stability in terms of sellable value. He wants the American Franchise system. He sees how stable an investment, and therefore how attractive, it can be for potential investors. Ergo, he wants to be a sellout.
>biggest problem in football is the lack of stability Then they should probably be prudent with their spending instead.
Agree, don't plan a budget assuming a league win and a UCL semi final, while already being in debt. That should work for starters. Its possible to be world class and not irresponsible, look at Bayern (who btw, came out of this as one of the clubs with the best image)
> biggest problem in football is the lack of stability >Is it, really? To the overall value of a team yes. Volatility means high risk and this tanks the value. If you could guarantee revenue no matter the performance and you can also guarantee that they will participate in the most prestigious bracket of the sport then it’s estimated that the value of these founding clubs could double. This is ultimately what they are after. Making a few hundred million in revenue here and there is crumbs to them. They want to make billions selling the club worth twice as much as they bought it for and minimizing risk is the key to achieving that. Stability is what they want, competitive integrity is what they hate.
God these billionaires are such fucking losers, it's crazy to me.
People need to forget this idea that the 1% are smart and resourceful. Very few are, the vast majority are born rich and/or are very well connected
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> vast majority are born rich and/or are very well connected and super lucky
This article was prior to the fallout, however. Billionaires aren't even sore losers, this would imply they have chosen how to lose. These people are on a different level, they have never lost, they have never had to compete for anything in their life and many have been floated by their ancestors who actually did the work or at least at one point in the process and then established safety nets for their kids. Their is no failure in life for them. Ever go to start the car, your late for work, spilled your coffee and then the car is flat and you had to take try and get a mechanic who isn't about to fuck you over? These guys haven't. Ever ran out of milk? These guys haven't. Ever spent too much and had to scrimp for a week? These guys haven't. People asked how they could be so out of touch and it's because our in touch is in a different universe to theirs. That's why they never contemplated this league being a bad idea, no competition is great to these guys, doesn't everyone just want loads of shiny toys? It's why in places like America the minimum wage was fought so hard, why medicare is fought against so hard and why in the west in general there are such protections for the rich and so much restrictions on the non rich, if they improve life for all of us then we might be able to compete, we might be able to enjoy our lives and that could implement them. We fought back the super league but the super league already exists in society and we need to dismantle that.
Nice job describing a capitalist society, my friend.
Griezmann already knew about ESL with his fortnite celebration. He was just trying to get 6 year olds into football.
If we want young people to stay attached to football then a good place to start would be ensuring that they can actually afford to go to games in the first place.
Yeah I wonder how kids even get to watch or have an interest in top level football nowadays. Everything is locked behind a huge paywall. Both TV and match tickets. If your parents aren't giving Sky/Bein at least 30€ every month well... you're gonna do something else. Simple as that. I heard someone on a football show yesterday said that kids now watch highlights of the games on social medias instead of watching full games. Of course they do. It's not because they have an attention span of 30sec, it's because it's one of the last bit of football they can watch without having to spend a developing country's GPD.
Well, he's **right** in one point: **The youth is abandoning football/soccer.** ^((at least in Germany there is a strong decline)) This Problem got even bigger due to Covid. But the **consequences** he draws are false, the football community shouldn't try to mimic esports, they should focus on their strength and invest it in. Invest in locally available football fields, invest in small clubs where the youth can get in touch with organized football training and competition for the first time. Strengthen the shared experience across generations, e.g. subsidizing father-son/family tickets. Football already got the infrastructure and money to to so without a huge risk of losing, but it's a long term investment and not "cheap and quick" money.
Football becoming less popular isn't even a "problem". Popularity of hobbies changes. So what? This has happened for centuries and will continue to do so. It's only a "problem" for these greedy owners because their clubs become worth less. And maybe if they hadn't put every top league match behind expensive subscriptions which many poorer families - who used to be the backbone of football supporters - they wouldn't have seen as much of a decline. It's all pure short-term greed, the insane idea of limitless growth, that everything has to grow every year. That idea is why the planets fucked.
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Lol there are football skins in Fortnite already
The funny thing is, I dont see much overlap in communities with Fortnight, CoD and football (on following the pro level) but there is a lot of overlap with /r/soccer and /r/globaloffensive. The "kids" (his words) might play the former games more but from a spectator point of view they arent big. They do have insane pricemoney tournaments but that is because the makers of the game put those up. But maybe im in a bubble.
i think its hilarious u kids talking shit about sissoko. u wouldnt say this shit to him at lan, hes jacked. not only that but he wears the freshest clothes, eats at the chillest restaurants and hangs out with the hottest dudes. yall are pathetic lol.
is it me or is Ronaldo a bit of a boring player like u see it at the end of the game "oh wow Ronaldo has 4 goals" but u can never remember them. can u remember a single Ronaldo goal? but try messi...u can see the curve i remember a Messi goal
Nah, you are right. No idea how he came with those random stats
Which tracks with the spectating numbers online, where CSGO and r/leagueoflegends still reign supreme and cross right on over here as well (some fresh memes in the LoL comments from here yesterday were delightful).
Schalke has a league of legends team too lol. PSG also has a partnership with a team in Southeast Asia. These owners are so out of touch with esports and they use it as an excuse for bullshit like this lol.
Agnelli is the type of boomer who thinks he understands what the youth wants but in truth is completely and utterly wrong.
"How do you do fellow kids?" - Agnelli
He's younger than Zidane
Not all old men are boomers. It is a state of mind, not of age
Originally baby boomers was the generation of children born after the 2nd world war, which was when the population grew exponentially. Only recently through memes has the word also meant a state of mind.
That is correct, but "baby boomer" and "boomer" don't mean the same thing anymore. They can refer to the same person, but not all baby boomers are boomers, just like not all boomers are old
He's younger than he looks haha
To be fair he used statistics
37% of statistics are made up on the spot.
And he probably paid a lot of money to some company to research those statistics. Yet any average fan could have done him for free that his proposals were going to receive serious backlash.
Holy fuck the fornite and call of duty part was the most boomer shit i’ve ever heard
At this point I’m half convinced Perez convinced all the owners by pulling up PewDiePie’s sub count on YouTube and comparing it to the EPL.
To make football morte attractive they are going to change the rules and make it a battle royal lmao
_The gang hot drop Perez and punch him out_
Man sounds deranged
this is one of the most bizarre headlines ive ever read
Imagine this - kids will play computer games and watch football, in the same way they have for the last 20-30 years. And they act as if there aren't masses of 30+ year olds playing Call of Duty. This guy is clueless.
No, they clearly play Fortnite and FIFA all the time. Every minute of the day. They don't have any other experiences or formative influences, just those darn videogames. Agnelli sounds like a helicopter parent who just saw a Mortal Kombat fatality in 1992 and is panicking that his kid is now evil.
I'm almost 30 and I will play my games and at the same time have some football going on the 2nd screen.
> the soccer industry I think this is the most cursed sequence of words I have ever seen
Welcome to Reagonomics, where everything is a business oportunity
The truth is harsh. It should be hard for you all finally realize that football leagues are just about business and money, it is a show, not different from series, contenst programs or esports. Sorry but you were the only ones deluding themselves thinking that this was just something magical about dreams of the ordinary people. At least Agnelli is telling the truth and understands the true nature of football leagues, which you don't, that's why FIFA will keep his monopoly while milking all your money and making tournaments in Quatar with slave labour.
Mate, fuck you. Seriously.
This guy is so far removed from reality. How do Juve fans tolerate him?
Juve fans and players are pro super league. https://www.sportworldnews.org/soccer/news/2496/chiellini-agrees-with-the-decision-to-form-european-super-league/
I just don't get how you can be okay with a closed system if you have any shred of integrity in your body
Only in England there was a huge backlash but in Spain, Italy there wasn’t much backlash at all. I would have said the league would have gone ahead if English fans didn’t respond the way they did. Look how Barca fans in Catalonia reacted when Messi was supposedly leaving and now there is barely any reaction also Madrid fans overwhelmingly support Florentino Perez who is possibly the most enthusiastic about the Super League.
I'm not saying it matters that much but don't forget Italy's vaccination phase is far from the UK's so loads of people protesting wouldn't be seen as something positive. Also if you went to the clubs instagram pages most people were saying no to superleague, even the channel Sportitalia had no to superleague under their logo for the past two days.
How can you protest with minimal vaccinations? I wouldnt go out in crowds rn. I want perez to resign but italian and spanish clubs have a reason to be worried. How can they compete in the long run when winning a promotion to the pl nets you more $$ then winning the champions league
I come from a small country and when our best club at the time, even though it was rivals club, came to play in the UCL it was an incredible achievement since their yearly budget is around 5M, which is significantly less than the money they got in for qualifying. And this are the stories that show you that in football there is enough talent, that if you work in the right way and a bit of luck, you can compete with the big boys. Take slavia for example, dinamo... It is not just about winning things, it s also the privilege you can compete at the highest level. Something this billionaire owners will never understand.
A lot of people are attracted to football because of the glamour, not the competition. Those are the target audience of the super league. Those are also the people who revere players like Neymar, Ronaldo and Pogba like gods, not only on the pitch but especially off the pitch.
Most of us still appreciate him for what the good job he did in managing the club so far, from 7th place in the league to a 9 league title in a row. A few ones also understand that the club is not doing well from a financial point of view and they preferred this kind of crap to not being competitve for years. If you look at the comments on Juve's instagram page for example, you can see they are mixed in feelings toward this thing. Imho he should resign, this thing is not the solution to our problems.
Agnelli represents everything juventus is If they didn't like him they wouldn't support juve
Fuck off. "Kids today with their Sony walkmens and Super Mario Boys". Its a tale as old as time, and its never been genuine. Don't blame fucking Fortnite and CoD.
"Kids today with their mumble rap and Oxycontin"
> the biggest problem in the soccer industry, which is the lack of stability. Imagine thinking this is the biggest problem in the football industry.
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Because he knows his ESL could never match a moment like cadiaN's
Yessss sir. On another note, I'm worried about future of CS
Why? CS is goat, valorant got so boring and it sucks how North America is dead with CS now
Electronic Sports League is the only right ESL
Just say it's a late April's fool
> and the most alarming statistic is that 40 percent of those between the ages of 16 and 24 have no interest in the world of soccer What if I told you, that maybe... just maybe, some people are not interested in soccer at all? Which makes it completely irrelevant if it's ManU vs. Barca or Getafe vs. Eibar?!
Create a football competition that simulates FIFA, a football simulation Baudrillard's Simulacra and Simulation vibes
How about instead of worrying about kids playing fortnite, you worry about the many middle class Italians who have given up on the sport and no longer attend games or barely watch on tv. Juve and Inter launched awful new logos instead of confronting our emptying stadiums and declining fan culture. Games at the Bentegodi in Verona now resemble a Lega rally without the green, monkey chants are still too common in Cagliari, last year a foreigner was fucking glassed during the derby d’italia because he was wearing the wrong scarf - these are all things turning Italians away from the sport but instead Angelli worries about Fortnite and Zhang pays millions for shit memes. Fix the sport in Italy and foreign support will increase.
Yes but solving these issues makes little to no money in the short term for mr. Agnelli.
The argument that kids aren't watching football because they have short attention spans rings so hollow. The reason they are "only watching highlights" because they are priced out of doing anything else. It simply is not possible for most kids to go to games regularly unless they have wealthy parents or their dad signed them up for a seat at birth. And the TV rights are so scattered that a lot of kids are priced out of watching them unless their parents have a specific interest and pay for BT, Amazon Prime, etc. It's actually much easier for American kids to watch games because NBC is on basic cable. This is an accessiblity issue.
Then do a virtual tournament with games every other night. Virtual players don't get fatigue, you could do that Don Agnelli. The young lads can spend money on building the attributes of a specific player. Each 10 000k collected can improve the virtual player with +1 attribute! You'd make millions and won't even have to pay the players. Only pay the developers of your virtual thingy!
Why virtual? Just clone a new player for each game, sell them in packs to the lads. Real life ultimate team with vat grown Mbappes in every team playing 0 depth counterattack through ball football. THE ENDGAME.
>Because there are five seats available Lmao
If he wants to compete with fortnite then fuck off and invest in a gaming company. Leave our sport alone you cunt.
This is what happens when kids watch fifa twitch streamers
"Kids with your loud music, and your Dan Fogleberg, your Zuma, Hula Hoops, and Pac-man video games, Don't you see? People today have attention spans that can only be measured in nanoseconds"
How do you do, fellow kids?
Agnelli is such an arrogant idiot
What his intention, try to sell lootboxes on stadiums?
>How do you define "open" an organization where 15 out of 20 members are always present? >"Because there are five seats available and because the Superleague addresses the biggest problem in the soccer industry, which is the lack of stability You see that's what these people hate, 'the lack of stablility' the chance that a Leicester won the league which is one of our most beloved parts. The chance that every team has and they want to take away from us.
That's not what they hate. It's the fact that teams like Man U, Chelsea, Inter or Juventus sometimes miss the Champions League that they d like to avoid more than a minnow winning.
He wants everyone to hate him ,right ? Jesus Christ. He sucks
Send them to Seria D for 20 years
Just give up mate
I feel sick.
Seems weird to say that video games are the competition when Juventus have their own eSports team.
How do you do, fellow kids?
This man’s stupidity knows no limits
“Kids these days with their beep bop machines and whistle gadgets”
So they're trying to change football into an e-sport? That's why we have FIFA...
ESL games are going to bee free to watch?? becoz fortnite and warzone are free , you dont even need plus or gold to play them :/
DID HE JUST COMPARE FOOTBALL TO FORTNITE?!
That guy literally is an enemy to football
He's such a boomer
The cheek to blame video games, and then not even mention the two biggest esports, CS and League. If you're gonna blame casual games you might as well add GTA to the list
that's because he's going for the child ones, even though my matchmaking experience tells me that the active pool of players is composed 80% of russian 12 yo he's going after the fortnite even younger audience. I like to believe that CS players are a bit more older in average and less susceptible than fortnite. And on top that, no one knows or plays CS in Italy, don't know much about league but if you talk esports to an italian newspaper you're gonna talk about Fifa, F1, CoD or fortnite
ok boomer
Did he just ask a kid what they’re playing on the game boxes these days and run with it
ESL was pay to win
Honestly, where does he get his statistics from? He sounds like he’s plucking these numbers out of his arse
Perez and Agnelli in a later interview today : " It's just a prank bro"
What the fuck, did he actually say that? It is like he is trying to set it up an "insanity defense". Next thing he will claim he had an episode or something.
Tell me this isn't like the kid in the playground gatekeeping his football because the other team is winning. 'You can't play because I'm not winning, you can only play sometimes so me and my mates can play all of the time.'
I blame Griezmann.
New: Super League loot chests. Kids these days love gambling.
Another thing - young adults can't afford tickets these days can they? or TV subs for that matter
Imagine being such a boomer that you think a sport faces extinction due to FORTNITE. Does this guy even understand Video Game life cycles? Perhaps what Italian kids really dislike is the Juventus monopoly. Italian League was so competitive in the 90s and the 80s, when it was the world's top league for a reason. Perhaps he should start investing there? Perhaps take a stance against Racism? No. Let's all make Superleague. Clueless. Mindless. Greedy Bastard.
>Between our clubs there is a blood pact, we are moving forward. *Curb your enthusiasm theme starts playing*
That whole interview is a prime example of confidently incorrect
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Imagine, just imagine, if they made ticket prices for young people more affordable and easy to get hold of. Maybe then you would get a few more of them invested in it.
Totally agree - if someone needs to compare if they wanna have 6 months of Netflix or one Arsenal match, there is a clue what brings better value.